Author Topic: The Day Before Roswell  (Read 26087 times)

Offline A51Watcher

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The Day Before Roswell
« on: November 13, 2011, 03:56:40 PM »
A while back Stanton Friedman told me that Roswell was not the beginning, but actually the end of a period when Flying Discs (as they were called back then) were buzzing the entire United States continuously for an entire 2 weeks BEFORE Roswell.

He suggested I should go have a look through the newspaper microfiche archives in my area because the majority of these sightings were right in my area.

I did so and... he turned out to be 100% correct.

Every day front page headlines. I am attaching scans and text of those 2 weeks.

Also our top brass were being grilled by reporters as to what the deal was. They denied any knowledge and thus were being made to look bad since these things ripped through our skies with impunity and basically laughed at any chase craft.

As time has passed and I have done some traveling, I always make it a point to stop by the local library wherever I am and go through the microfiche archives for the summer/fall of 1947.

Reason being, it has been a jackpot every time without fail, and the stories vary from state to state, town to town, paper to paper.

Many stories are one of a kind not reprinted in other papers.

One of THE most interesting facts to emerge from all of this is:

The vast majority of locations the Discs came to and "visited" were top secret military installations.

The public did not know that at the time, but presently it is quite obvious why they would be visiting Hanford, WA (Kenneth Arnold's sighting and more) and of course Roswell, being the only nuclear air wing. Also White Sands, Los Alamos and more.

So as I traced their movements during this 2 weeks leading up to "the crash", I noted all the TS and black project areas they went straight for, as I'm sure the generals at the time did too.

They traveled in a pack, ranging from as small as 3 up to as large as 9 usually, 11 on one occasion.

They cut corners on a dime without slowing down.

They were silver sports models, and could emit intense bright light even during the day but usually did not do so.

The pattern of movement reminded me of a rock band on tour, day by day going to a different city, then moving on. The East Coast had a few days of big activity also.

The biggest surprise was when I went to Hong Kong for a friends wedding, and of course went to their library. He came along with great interest and I started as usual a full month before Roswell to make sure I didn't miss anything.

Day by day the film rolls by and... nothing! I can't believe my eyes because I had never come up empty before. The entire critical 2 weeks and -nada-.

I keep going, and surprisingly not even the famous AAF captures flying disc story or the follow up balloon story was not run.

But yet I keep going on sort of in stunned disbelief, then finally, a full 2 weeks AFTER Roswell, jackpot! The shiny fleet of 9 arrives during mid day as 100's of Chinese dock workers, and various townspeople watch in amazement at their speed and sharp movements.

Here are the excerpts from what I found that first trip:

06/25/47 Kenneth Arnold reports his sighting

06/26/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Flying Disk Mystery Grows
-2 Midwest Men Support Boise Flier
-Descriptions tally On Fast - Flying Pie Pan Objects
-Nine mysterious objects hurtling through the air

06/26/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Oklahoman Sees Strange Objects

06/26/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Carpenter Reports 'Discs' in Midwest
-...Nine shiny objects flying at a high rate of speed

06/27/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Arnold Insists Tale Of Flying Objects O.K.
-..."It's God's truth - I will swear it on a Bible."

-...sighting the mysterious silvery disks sailing along in the sky...

06/27/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Picture of '7 dots' proves latest in flying disk case

06/27/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Objects Seen Several Times
-...traveling at an unbelievable speed

06/30/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Lads Declare They Saw "Flying Disks"

07/01/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Pastor Fears Confrere Errs in Air Mystery
-"the millennium is neigh because of the appearance of the "flying saucers."

07/02/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Flying Disk Reported Above Fort Stevens
-..."There is a flying disk right now over Fort Stevens. It was dazzling bright and saucer- shaped. Everybody in the annex saw it." ...Mrs. Seado was asked to call another of the witnesses, preferably a man, to the phone...

(editors note: lmao)

07/02/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Spokane Jailer Says He Saw It
-jet planes "are very slow in comparison with what I saw."

07/02/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Rankin Report Adds Credence to 'Disks'
-...New reports meanwhile came in from 3 Oregon cities...

07/03/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Army Looks Into Flying Disk Stories
-...At first, Army officers laughed off the reports. Now..."it is our responsibility to know about it and take action."

(editors note: mm hmm)

07/03/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - More Report 'Disks"; Platter-Shaped Now
-...compared the "saucers" speed to that of a "shooting star."

07/03/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Woman Reports Flying Saucers

07/04/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Tell It to Admiral!
-...Two Navy chief petty officers today reported seeing flying disks...

07/04/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Richland Man Saw Arnold's Formation
-..."these disks certainly were traveling faster than ANY P-28."

-...8 Portland area policeman and deputy sheriff's...numerous private citizens, the crew of a United Airlines plane, and a Coastguardsman who claims to have photographed one... the alert was sounded over police radio... a score of calls that the disks were overhead... Flashes Seen, Noise Lacking - OBJECT UNIDENTIFIED - ...the disk could change at a 90- degree angle without difficulty... terrific speed. "The disks would oscillate and sometimes we would see a full disk,then a half-moon shape, then nothing at all."

07/05/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Airlines Crew Confirms Reports Of Flying Disks: Five Spotted

07/05/47 - OREGONIAN - Air Liner Crew Confirms flying Discs Over State
-Many Seen During Day Over City
-Three Sight Objects-Police Cars Alerted-Veterans Spy Objects-Deputies Report Streaks-Flashes Seen, Noise Lacking-OBJECT UNIDENTIFIED...nine in all..terrific speed... described the sight as a "wobbling hubcap"...

07/06/47 - OREGONIAN - Flying Saucers Everywhere: New Tales Convert Skeptics
-Puzzle Alerts Entire Nation To Scan Sky
-Pilot Sees Objects First - Reports Come in From East
-Former skeptics joined the ranks of believers as the flashing objects glimmered before their eyes...

(editors note: heh heh heh)

-...said he had seen a similarly shaped object some weeks earlier, but fear of ridicule kept him quiet
-...And for the first time, the eastern states had their reports...
-...saw a silvery object fly southward, halt abruptly and then retrace it's course

07/06/47 - OREGONIAN - 'Flying Disc' Reports Come From Hundreds, in 28 States
-Reports Come in From All Over Nation Telling of Sighting Mysterious Discs
-...came from all points of the continent
-...Science Fails To Give Facts
-Public Advised Discs Harmless

07/07/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Disc Floats to Earth, Flies On, Paper Told
-...he saw a flying disk float to the ground in front of him, stop a few seconds, then take off again...
-...Six persons reported seeing the discs in flight...

-Ashland Picknickers Spot Flying Saucers flew south, occasionally "jumping sideways"

07/07/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Tacoma Cops Spy Discs Around 'Mother'
-..."6 or 7" flying saucers...said "a central saucer appeared to act as a sort of flagship... terrific speed."

07/07/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Saucers in Sydney
-...disc shaped objects shooting across the sky...

07/07/47 - OREGONIAN - Eight 'Flying Saucers' Reported Down on Idaho Mountain"
-Air Search Scheduled For Region
-Flights continue To Be Observed Over Wide Area
-Extreme Speed Reported

07/07/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Guard Planes Patrol "Flying Saucer" Routes
-Land and Air Search for Discs in Idaho Fails

07/07/47 - OREGONIAN - Air Forces Deny Discs U.S. Made
-Air Force Investigation
-Aluminum Discs Seen

07/07/47 - The New York Times - Military Planes Hunt Sky Discs With Cameras in Vain on Coast
-Missile Theory Discounted
-"Washtubs" Fall and Vanish
-Two Visitations in Jersey

07/08/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Air Enigma Baffles U.S.
-The Army Air forces disclaimed any knowledge of where the flying saucers originate...



07/08/47 - The New York Times - 'Disks' Soar Over New York, Now Seen Aloft in All colors

when the intelligence office of the 509th Bomb Group of the Eighth Air Force, Roswell Army Airfield was fortunate enough to gain possesion of a disc

07/09/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Friends Back Disc Spotter in Portland
-...started moving at a terrific speed

07/09/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Army Says New Mexico 'Disc' Wind Balloon
-Reports Fewer

07/09/47 - The New York Times - 'Disk' Near bomb Test Site Is Just a Weather Balloon
-`Flying Saucer' tales pour in from round the world

07/10/47 - OREGONIAN - Saucer story slows speed
-The furore over flying saucers seems to have abated considerably...

07/10/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Flying Discs All But Gone, Few Reported

07/10/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Practical Jokers Carry Ball for Flying Discs

07/10/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Roseburg Priest Reports Discs
-"...seemed to be jiggling and darting about",... "the flashes were awfully bright and were obviously from a metallic object."

07/11/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - Wisconsin 'Discs' rigged for Power

07/11/47 - OREGON JOURNAL - 'Genuine Saucer' Looks Like Gag

-Flight Seen As 2 Planes Follow Path ...the object was larger than two planes which they said were "following" it

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2011, 04:00:14 PM »

Originally posted by Condemned0625

Nice find. I had no idea there were this many sightings before the Roswell "crash" (I know they shot it down, including another).

I figured you would pick upon my various sarcasm about "the crash". Obviously the Army was in a pickle, and was daily being made fools of by these things that demonstrated vast superiority, and that the Army was unable to control/defend our skies.

So I wonder which scenario happened in private with the General and his staff seated around a conference table:

A) General: "Gee I hope one of those pretty flying saucers comes down and lands and introduces themselves to us, they are makin us look kinda bad right now. Let me know when that happens ok?"


B) General: "I don't care WHAT it takes... BRING ONE OF THOSE THINGS DOWN... NOW!!!
Do you understand me??!!

"...Guard planes "patrol" saucer routes with camera's..." Yeah you bet, along with our top weapons of the day too!!
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 10:46:55 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2011, 04:03:44 PM »

Originally posted by LDragonFire
reply to post by A51Watcher

Many theorize that when we stated setting off nukes that this caught the attention of others in our galaxy....

reply by annella

I agree totally. It seems that maybe Hiroshima and Nagasaki may have been the catalyst for the years of sightings immediately after that sad event. Cant blame any ETs wanting to check out just what the Hell we mere Earthlings had gotten up to with those great big clouds that spelled disaster!!

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 10:48:01 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2011, 05:28:46 PM »
Originally posted by havok
...So after seeing all the stories from Oregon up until the Roswell story....
I have to think that the reason it got dropped, or 'explained', is rather obvious.

When you have documents stating how the gov't infiltrated big name newspapers in the 40's...

What caught my eye was after "the change", was that:

Reports dried up (except for those few people that again got wowed by a sighting and thought it their civic and human duty to warn their fellow citizens), and the public "got" the implied message that if you now reported one (after the sensible balloon explanation for it all (??) you would be considered gullible and a kook. It was now "cool" to ridicule them.

Message #2 that came through loud and clear was the implied threat: "Hey EVERYBODY knows it was all a weather balloon now, you want to be like everybody right?, You don't want to be some kind of weirdo different commie right?"

That psychology tool is still at work today.

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2011, 05:56:17 PM »

Major Donald E. Keyhoe, who lived through that two week period (later dubbing it "The Saucer Scare" period, due to the escalating public tension due to the daily increasing sightings reaching massive proportions, while the Military stood by helpless to do anything about it, let alone provide an answer), and afterward he contacted his many friends and contacts in the military and the Pentagon to determine what had happened. He details his search in his 1950 book -

The Flying Saucers Are Real.
He provides additional details from witnesses known to the public and also those that were not:
He quotes Kenneth Arnold, who said he saw "...nine gleaming disks outlined against the snow, each one about the size of a C-54,...They flew close to the mountaintops, in a diagonal chainlike line... It was as if linked together".

He also relates that most Americans were unaware that the Pentagon had been receiving disk reports as early as January... "After seeing the Pentagon comment I had called up Captain Tom Brown at Air Force Public Relations" and related that he had heard that Civil Air Patrol in Wisconsin and other states were starting a sky search.

Brown: "We've got a jet at Muroc, and six fighters standing by at Portland right now,"


Brown: "I've no report on that. But I know some of them carry photographic equipment."

He relates that on July 8 at Muroc Air Force Base, where TS planes and devices are tested, six fast moving silvery-white saucers were seen by pilots and ground officers.

Both a Navy rocket expert (Dr. Robert B. McLaughlin) and an engineer (Charles B. Moore) who were there, each independently reported the same incident at White Sands where they had seen four saucers in that area.

The first saucer was tracked by White Sands observers with a theodolite. Then they worked out it's performance with ballistics formulas as being fifty miles up and making over fifteen thousand mph.

The staff at True magazine (a popular men's magazine of the day) compiled a list from current newspaper reports (later confirmed by Air Force case reports, including sightings at eleven Air Force bases and fourteen American airports and a score of encounters by airline and private pilots) of known worldwide sightings at that point that included Paraguay, Belgium, Turkey, Holland, Germany and the Scandinavian countries.

An additional interesting 1958 incident involving Major Keyhoe:
(from Wikipedia) "On 22 January 1958 Keyhoe appeared on a CBS live television show the Armstrong Circle Theatre to speak on the topic of UFOs. Keyhoe charged that a U.S. Congressional committee was evaluating evidence that "will absolutely prove that the UFOs are machines under intelligent control".

However CBS stopped the audio portion of the live broadcast. Herbert A. Carlborg, CBS Director of Editing stated "this program had been carefully cleared for security reasons".

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 10:49:12 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2011, 06:23:34 PM »
Another early author that came up with interesting details way ahead of his time was:

Frank Edwards and his 1966 book -

This is where I read the only report I have seen about the event, published post-Roswell in such detail, decades before Major Marcel broke his silence and came forward.

"There are such difficult cases as the rancher near Roswell, NM who phoned the sheriff that a blazing disc-shaped object had passed over his house at low altitude and had crashed and burned on a hillside within view of the house.

 The sheriff called the military: the military came on the double quick. Newsmen were not permitted in the area.

A week later however the government released a photograph of a serviceman holding up a box kite with an aluminum disc about the size of a large pie pan dangling from the bottom of the kite.

This, the official report explained, was a device borne aloft on the kite and used to test the radar gear by bouncing the signals off the pie pan.

And this, we were told, was the sort of thing that had so excited the rancher. We were not told however how the alleged kite caught fire.- nor why the military cordoned off the area while they inspected the wreckage of a burned-out box kite with a non-inflammable pie pan tied to it."

Frank was of course referring to one of the Major Jessie Marcel Sr. photos, in which he states he was ordered to pose with falsified wreckage and stay silent about it.

...and then one of Gen. Ramey (on left) and his Chief of Staff, Col. Thomas Dubose (on right) obviously seriously examining the wreckage.

...and then another of the two of them laughing about what an idiot Major Marcel must be.

"Gee the Intelligence officer of our most important secret base, (because it is our only nuclear squadron of the day) apparently can't tell the difference between a weather balloon and a spaceship from Mars! Hahahaha!

Marcel swore that in private when he was ordered to pose with the false wreckage and keep quiet, he was promised "that one day, when this all comes out, you will be made a hero!" He patiently endured that shame and waited for that day in silence. That day never came and so shortly before he died he gave a few interviews stating in no uncertain terms what had really happened that day.

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 10:57:53 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2011, 06:48:01 PM »

Originally posted by babybunnies
... often suspected that this was never a crash, that it was shot down, but this lays it all out very, very well.

New details I am reading now seem to actually contain a new sighting I had not read before, that well could be from when it was first "shot down" (well actually blindsided and separated from the rear of the pack and then hurled earthward, then suffering a "crash" landing... but we wanted this thing intact as much as possible).

Also additional sightings of it then continuing to fly wounded down towards Roswell, accompanied by a second craft, with more sightings of them along the way to Roswell.

Any additional info we might get from the archives could really help narrow this down.

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 10:58:52 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2011, 06:52:28 PM »

Originally posted by C64Warrior
Great thread and placed Roswell for me into a new light. I was always a believer in the Roswell case. But understood, that people were and still are receptive for the weather balloon explanation.

Now looking at your findings, the old weather balloon excuse just looks pretty funny. UFO sightings all over the place, reported from many many people, even mass sightings.

And what does the Air Force capture? A weather balloon  Was it disc shaped? 

Great description there!  And even better sarcasm than mine! 
Yes the balloon story is beyond laughable at this point. (Oh has any one noticed that the "new" explanation given by the Air Force, citing the secret Mogul balloon project with dummies, did not begin until 6 years AFTER Roswell?
.... D'oh!)
(Is this a backhanded method of disclosure, saying stuff that is so stupid everyone knows you are lying?)

So anyway, we had guard planes patrolling saucer routes for a weather balloon? We had fighters and a jet on standby for weather balloons?

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 10:59:24 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2011, 07:37:53 PM »

Who knows better what really happened on that day,
than -the men who were actually involved in the event- ?

Well besides Major Jessie Marcel, who was pictured front page across the nation, we also have another member of that event from the previous day, who was the man responsible for the headline heard round the world:

Lt. Walter Haut, then the public information officer for the 509th Bomb Group in Roswell:

In WWII, Lt. Haut had been a navigator and then a bombardier as a crew member of the 509th,
but on that fateful day in 1947, after weeks of intense UFO sightings, he issued this stunning official AAF release to the nation's press:

"The many rumors regarding the flying disc became a reality yesterday when the intelligence office of the 509th Bomb Group of the Eighth Air Force, Roswell Army Airfield was fortunate enough to gain possesion of a disc through the cooperation of one of the local ranchers and the sheriff's office of Chaves County. The flying object landed on a ranch near Roswell sometime last week. Not having phone facilities, the rancher stored the disc until such time as he was able to contact the sheriff's office, who in turn notified Maj. Jesse A. Marcel of the 509th Bomb Group Intelligence Office. Action was immediately taken and the disc was picked up at the rancher's home. It was inspected at the Roswell Army Air Field and subsequently loaned by Major Marcel to higher headquarters."

From that day on, until his death in 2005, Lt. Haut kept his oath and never revealed publicly what he knew about the monumentous events of that day in Roswell.
However in 2000, he privately gave an interview with 2 researchers he trusted, first stipulating that the interview was not to be released until after his death. Then in 2002, he prepared a notarized affidavit, which was sealed and not to be made public until after his death, and thus he kept a promise made to Col. Blanchard, to not disclose it while he was alive.

So in his own words, what did yet another -man who was actually involved in the event- have to say about that fateful day?

"In July, 1947, I was stationed at the Roswell Army Air Base in Roswell, New Mexico, serving as the base Public Information Officer. I had spent the 4th of July weekend (Saturday, the 5th, and Sunday, the 6th) at my private residence about 10 miles north of the base, which was located south of town.

I was aware that someone had reported the remains of a downed vehicle by midmorning after my return to duty at the base on Monday, July 7. I was aware that Major Jesse A. Marcel, head of intelligence, was sent by the base commander, Col. William Blanchard, to investigate.
By late in the afternoon that same day, I would learn that additional civilian reports came in regarding a second site just north of Roswell. I would spend the better part of the day attending to my regular duties hearing little if anything more.

On Tuesday morning, July 8, I would attend the regularly scheduled staff meeting at 7:30 a.m.

Besides Blanchard,
CIC [Counterintelligence Corp] Capt. Sheridan Cavitt;
Col. James I. Hopkins, the operations officer;
Lt. Col. Ulysses S. Nero, the supply officer;
and from Carswell AAF in Fort Worth, Texas, Blanchard's boss, Brig. Gen. Roger Ramey
and his chief of staff, Col. Thomas J. Dubose were also in attendance.

The main topic of discussion was reported by Marcel and Cavitt regarding an extensive debris field in Lincoln County approx. 75 miles NW of Roswell.

A preliminary briefing was provided by Blanchard about the second site approx. 40 miles north of town.

Samples of wreckage were passed around the table. It was unlike any material I had or have ever seen in my life. Pieces which resembled metal foil, paper thin yet extremely strong, and pieces with unusual markings along their length were handled from man to man, each voicing their opinion. No one was able to identify the crash debris.

One of the main concerns discussed at the meeting was whether we should go public or not with the discovery.

Gen. Ramey proposed a plan, which I believe originated from his bosses at the Pentagon. Attention needed to be diverted from the more important site north of town by acknowledging the other location. Too many civilians were already involved and the press already was informed. I was not completely informed how this would be accomplished.

At approximately 9:30 a.m. Col. Blanchard phoned my office and dictated the press release of having in our possession a flying disc, coming from a ranch northwest of Roswell, and Marcel flying the material to higher headquarters. I was to deliver the news release to radio stations KGFL and KSWS, and newspapers the Daily Record and the Morning Dispatch.

By the time the news release hit the wire services, my office was inundated with phone calls from around the world. Messages stacked up on my desk, and rather than deal with the media concern, Col Blanchard suggested that I go home and "hide out."

Before leaving the base, Col. Blanchard took me personally to Building 84 [AKA Hangar P-3], a B-29 hangar located on the east side of the tarmac. Upon first approaching the building, I observed that it was under heavy guard both outside and inside.

Once inside, I was permitted from a safe distance to first observe the object just recovered north of town. It was approx. 12 to 15 feet in length, not quite as wide, about 6 feet high, and more of an egg shape. Lighting was poor, but its surface did appear metallic. No windows, portholes, wings, tail section, or landing gear were visible.

Also from a distance, I was able to see a couple of bodies under a canvas tarpaulin. Only the heads extended beyond the covering, and I was not able to make out any features. The heads did appear larger than normal and the contour of the canvas suggested the size of a 10 year old child. At a later date in Blanchard's office, he would extend his arm about 4 feet above the floor to indicate the height.

I was informed of a temporary morgue set up to accommodate the recovered bodies.

I was informed that the wreckage was not "hot" (radioactive).

Upon his return from Fort Worth, Major Marcel described to me taking pieces of the wreckage to Gen. Ramey's office and after returning from a map room, finding the remains of a weather balloon and radar kite substituted while he was out of the room. Marcel was very upset over this situation. We would not discuss it again.

I would be allowed to make at least one visit to one of the recovery sites during the military cleanup. I would return to the base with some of the wreckage which I would display in my office.

I was aware two separate teams would return to each site months later for periodic searches for any remaining evidence.

I am convinced that what I personally observed was some type of craft and its crew from outer space."

[Source: Tom Carey & Donald Schmitt, Witness to Roswell, 2007]

So there you have it. Another man, -who was actually involved in the event-, revealing the true Alien nature of the event.

_______________________________Walter G. Haut
________________________________ 1922 - 2005
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 11:00:13 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2011, 07:46:13 PM »
Originally posted by zorgon

Major Donald Keyhoe Part 1 of 3 Mike Wallace Interview 3/8/1958




Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2011, 08:01:13 PM »

After researching the leads and links posted so far in this thread, I now have evidence that sightings during this 1947 period were also reported in the following countries:

South Africa
South America
Hungary (Budapest)
and the Scandinavian countries.

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 11:01:10 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2011, 08:11:55 PM »
This is a new (to me) sighting report(s) from 1947 that appears to have 2 different locations listed:

27 Aug 47 - SECRET HEADQUARTERS FOURTH AIR FORCE Office of the Assistant Chief of Staff,
A-2 Intelligence Hamilton Field, California 4AFDA 333.5/1208-I 27 August 1947

SUBJECT: Re Flying Disc
TO: Headquarters, Sixth Army, San Francisco, California.

1. Following is extract from the Weekly Intelligence Summary, Air Transport Command, Washington 25, D.C., dated 20 August 1947, Copy No. 120, Article I, pg 1: "FLYING OBJECTS IN GUAM": Unidentified flying objects have been observed by three American enlisted men of the 147th Airways and Air Communications Service Squadron at Harmon Field, Guam. The men report that at 1040 hours on 14 August 1947 the two objects, which they describe as small, crescent shaped and traveling at a speed twice that of a jet fighter plane, passed over
them on a zig-zag course in a westerly direction at an approximate altitude of twelve hundred feet. The objects disappeared into clouds and a few seconds later a similar object possible one of those previously observed, emerged from the clouds and proceeded west. No further details have been reported."
2. For your information. DONALD L. SPRINGER Lt. Colonel, GSC AS of S, A-2


Aug 14, 1947 - Harmon Field, Newfoundland, Canada - 10:40 a.m.

3 AAF airmen with the 147th AACS Sq. saw 2 small crescent-shaped objects pass over them on a zigzag path at a speed twice that of jet fighter plane (1,200 mph?) heading W at about 1,200 ft. disappearing into clouds, a few secs later a same or similar object emerged from the clouds and continued to the W.
Source: (FOIA)

So Canada or Guam, which is it? A little research shows that:

Harmon Air Force Base was the World War II airfield on Guam (Harmon AFB was closed in 1949)

Ernest Harmon Air Force Base was the the Cold War base in Newfoundland, Canada.
(The base was built by the United States Army Air Forces in 1941 and closed in 1966)

The Air Force base in Canada was originally referred to as Stephenville Air Base, which was renamed Ernest Harmon Air Force Base on June 23, 1948, and thus could not be the Harmon base described in this 1947 incident.

Interesting to note that the report pried loose via the FOIA does not have the correct base or location listed.

and one other interesting find:

22 Aug 1947 - Memo fm AC/AS-2
From: Air Intelligence Requirements Division Collection Branch (Col Robert Taylor)
To: Deputy Chief of Staff for Research and Development: "Flying Saucer Phenomena";

"From a detailed study of certain reported observations on the flying saucers, is apparent that several aspects of their appearance have a common pattern.
...Before pursuing its investigation of these objects any further, this Office requests assurance that no research project of the Army Air Forces, at present being test-flown, has the following characteristics and that it may therefore assume that recent flying saucer 'mystery' is not of United States origin:
...Surface is metallic-- indicating a metallic skin, at least, to shape, all observations state that the object is circular, or at least elliptical, flat on the bottom and slightly domed on the top.
...Size estimates place it somewhere near the size of a C-54 or Constellation as they would appear while flying at 10,000'...
...Flights have been reported containing from three to nine objects, flying good formation on each other, with speeds always above 300 knots...The discs oscillate laterally while flying along, which could be snaking."

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2011, 08:21:15 PM »

Anunaki10 posted on 1-2-2011

Originally posted by TeslaandLyne
UFOs still go to President Ronald Reagan a one time ranch in New Mexico.
Tesla ships that is.

Spotted by Lyne a few times last year.
The man who sold the green skin color for the Roswell hoax.

Did Tesla made spaceships? How? Can you prove it?

Green Skin color for the Roswell hoax? What hoax? The weather/Mogul balloon was a hoax, yes, in other words to cover up the two crashed alien spacecrafts. And why use New Mexico as location to detect the Soviet nuclear bomb, when it seems more logic to use for example Alaska (which is far closer to the Soviet Union) to operate from there? The fact is the military used a WB-29 airplane attached with a filter to track airborne debris to detect the first Soviet nuclear bomb in 1949, and they used Eielson Air Force Base, Fairbanks, Alaska to operate from there. They didn't use Mogul Balloon train attached with Rawin Targets to detect the Soviet Nuclear bomb.
Some of the MJ-12 members decided to turn their back on the "Shadow Government", and even General Ramey who was ordered by the highest level to make the weather/Mogul balloon cover up story, he also decided to turn his back on the "Shadow Government" too, by saying that the weather/Mogul balloon cover up story was the biggest lie he ever had to tell, and about the UFO wreckage he said >>It was out of this world, son. Out of this world!<<.

Did you know that Batelle scientist Elroy John Center confessed to have analyzed the Roswell ET debris? Wow, isn't this just great?

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 11:03:46 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2011, 09:51:17 PM »
IsaacKoi posted on 5-2-2011

Originally posted by A51Watcher
A while back Stanton Friedman told me that Roswell was not the beginning, but actually the end of a period when Flying Discs (as they were called back then) were buzzing the entire United States continuously for an entire 2 weeks BEFORE Roswell.

Hi A51Watcher,

Further to your U2U asking if I had access to database information about sightings between 30th March 1947 and 3rd Septembmer 1947, I've had a look at one or two of the various UFO databases that I have obtained over the years.

The largest and most useful for present purposes is the huge UFOCAT database, started by Dr. David R. Saunders - a participant in the (in)famous Condon UFO study - over 40 years ago and currently updated and maintained by Donald A Johnson and sold by CUFOS.

For the period you asked about (i.e. 30 March 1947 to 3rd September 1947), the 2004 edition of that database had 2,578 entries.

Some UFO sightings have more than one entry in UFOCAT, so 2,578 does NOT equal 2,578 different sightings. I could probably work out the number of different sightings within that period stored in UFOCAT but it is probably in the order of about 2,000 different sightings.

The vast majority of those sightings were in the USA. While this can partially be explained by the fact that the researchers that compiled UFOCAT were generally in the USA and/or used sources written by American researchers, the dominance of reports from the USA within the period you mentioned is disproportionate to other periods also covered by UFOCAT.

In terms of Stan's comment about Roswell marking the end of a period, that obtains some support from the number of entries for UFO reports in UFOCAT before and after the Roswell newspaper reports on 8/9 July 1947.

The relevant numbers of entries in UFOCAT (which, once again, is not equal to the number of DIFFERENT sightings - which would involve a bit more work to ascertain) are:

21 June 1947 : 27 UFOCAT entries
22 June 1947 : 7 UFOCAT entries
23 June 1947 : 15 UFOCAT entries
24 June 1947 : 100 UFOCAT entries
25 June 1947 : 30 UFOCAT entries
26 June 1947 : 18 UFOCAT entries
27 June 1947 : 57 UFOCAT entries
28 June 1947 : 55 UFOCAT entries
29 June 1947 : 38 UFOCAT entries
30 June 1947 : 38 UFOCAT entries
01 July 1947 : 52 UFOCAT entries
02 July 1947 : 51 UFOCAT entries
03 July 1947 : 89 UFOCAT entries
04 July 1947 : 281 UFOCAT entries
05 July 1947 : 179 UFOCAT entries
06 July 1947 : 372 UFOCAT entries
07 July 1947 : 419 UFOCAT entries
08 July 1947 : 248 UFOCAT entries
09 July 1947 : 65 UFOCAT entries
10 July 1947 : 55 UFOCAT entries
11 July 1947 : 18 UFOCAT entries
12 July 1947 : 17 UFOCAT entries
13 July 1947 : 10 UFOCAT entries
14 July 1947 : 4 UFOCAT entries
15 July 1947 : 7 UFOCAT entries
16 July 1947 : 3 UFOCAT entries
17 July 1947 : 4 UFOCAT entries
18 July 1947 : 1 UFOCAT entries
19 July 1947 : 1 UFOCAT entries

Hope this helps,


« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 11:07:01 PM by A51Watcher »

Offline A51Watcher

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Re: The Day Before Roswell
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2011, 09:54:57 PM »

Update on 1947 International Sightings of flying disk's:

The following list is provided by Harold E. Burt, who has served on the Board of Directors for Orange County Chapter of MUFON.

Sightings in Europe:

April 20, 1947

Citizens in Col de Serres, France report seeing disks flying over the valley.

June 10, 1947

Fast-moving flying objects are seen in Finland.

July 7, 1947

In Sussex, England people see disks fly over the coast and out to sea.

Citizens in Naples, Italy report a slow-moving, shiny disk overhead.

Astronomers at Del Satto Observatory in Chile spot disks. Estimated speed: 3,000 miles per

Japan and Holland also report seeing high-speed disks on this day.

August 11, 1947

In Sweden over four hundred people see fast-moving disks fly overhead.

September 1, 1947

Greece: British army units see "mystery projectiles."

Harold E. Burt's Website

« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 11:18:32 PM by A51Watcher » USA, LLC
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