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Author Topic: marcus allen and the nasa pics  (Read 16097 times)

Offline stealthyaroura

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2012, 06:39:08 AM »
Take the above pic i posted, it's not just that it looks to good to be true,just take a look at the dust that IS NOT THERE that should of been kicked up off the rocket motor and dumped on the pads? Then look at the LM it looks like a flimsy model! And we know MANY were made. could 2/3 people fit in there?

Then take a look at the horizon, really that flat? i find it hard to believe that there are no boulders strewn about. :o
« Last Edit: June 29, 2012, 06:41:55 AM by stealthyaroura »
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Offline ArMaP

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #16 on: June 30, 2012, 01:39:52 PM »
Take the above pic i posted,
The one that says "image deep link = bandwidth theft"?  :)

Offline Amaterasu

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2012, 01:50:10 PM »
It was saying that to Me too, but is now just a broken image.
"If the universe is made of mostly Dark Energy...can We use it to run Our cars?"

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Offline ArMaP

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2012, 04:31:03 PM »
I suppose a Wikipedia source is better than that wallpaper site. :)



Now, where do you see multiple light sources? Multiple light sources would create multiple shadows, something that doesn't exist on that photo. And no, it's not "too good to be true" either, it shows too much ground, probably a result of having a chest-mounted camera.

Also, I don't understand why the dust blown by the engines should have landed on the landing pads, as it wasn't blown vertically.

Offline zorgon

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2012, 04:59:24 PM »
The one that says "image deep link = bandwidth theft"?  :)

It was saying that to Me too, but is now just a broken image.

Repaired with original from NASA

Offline zorgon

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2012, 05:05:45 PM »
nice example zorgon

You say "nice example zorgon"

Okay so...

...what is wrong in my picture besides the horizon? (this is about lighting ;) )

Offline The Seeker

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2012, 07:24:40 PM »
Let's see, Z; the sun is casting shadows at an angle to the Lem, the backside of the lem is definitely illuminated by a different light source that appears to be behind the camera to the upper left, the horizon is wayyy too close;


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Offline zorgon

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2012, 09:28:35 PM »
Let's see, Z; the sun is casting shadows at an angle to the Lem, the backside of the lem is definitely illuminated by a different light source that appears to be behind the camera to the upper left

Lets start with that  The sun is BEHIND the LEM according to the shadow, yet the front is lit up as bright as day when it should be pitch black in shadow

Now the astronaut coming out of that hatch... even the inside of the hatch area is lit up clearly.

There will be some reflected light from the surface of the moon, but stats are available on the amount of that reflection. There is no way reflection accounts for all that light

Now look closely at the clip below then check it in the full size image. Look where I put the yellow arrow and you will see a straight line where the image quality changes, like the exiting astronaut has been pasted over top




Offline Amaterasu

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #23 on: July 01, 2012, 04:41:34 AM »
I'm looking at the end of His backpack and thinking, no way would a light from the camera region light up that surface so brightly.  There is DEFINITELY a light source to the left of camera.
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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #24 on: July 01, 2012, 05:00:50 AM »
How many light sources are on the Moon to start with.
 
1) The Sun
2) The Stars
3) The Earth
4) Relective Light from above
5) Reflective Light from the LeM
6) Possibly of another source such as a Flash or light, Man Made.
7) Photo manipulation Addition of light to certain areas.
 
On 1 through 5, think of your life on Earth. For # 2 there are many nights I can walk around and see by star light if the clouds are gone. What difference does that light make if it is daytime or not. It is still added to the mix.  On #3 The Earth, When our moon is in the sky we can again read the paper and walk around with no extra lights. Even take pictures by moon light. Now we are many times the moons size, so I imagine we reflect a lot of light also. Just because it is daytime does not stop this either. Add reflections off of the surfaces and Astronauts equipment and I can see at least 5 light sources to begin with.
 
If you all can agree or dis-agree is in question. After that we look at #6 and 7 for proof.
 
But I see it as 5 to begin with.
 
Deuem

Offline Amaterasu

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #25 on: July 01, 2012, 05:43:27 AM »
How many light sources are on the Moon to start with.
 
1) The Sun
2) The Stars
3) The Earth
4) Relective Light from above
5) Reflective Light from the LeM
6) Possibly of another source such as a Flash or light, Man Made.
7) Photo manipulation Addition of light to certain areas.
 
On 1 through 5, think of your life on Earth. For # 2 there are many nights I can walk around and see by star light if the clouds are gone. What difference does that light make if it is daytime or not. It is still added to the mix.  On #3 The Earth, When our moon is in the sky we can again read the paper and walk around with no extra lights. Even take pictures by moon light. Now we are many times the moons size, so I imagine we reflect a lot of light also. Just because it is daytime does not stop this either. Add reflections off of the surfaces and Astronauts equipment and I can see at least 5 light sources to begin with.
 
If you all can agree or dis-agree is in question. After that we look at #6 and 7 for proof.
 
But I see it as 5 to begin with.
 
Deuem

And I disagree.  [smile]  There is no way the backpack end could be illuminated that brightly at that angle without an immediate light source to the left.  Reflected light is diffuse and would not create that degree of contrast.
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Offline ArMaP

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #26 on: July 01, 2012, 07:56:15 AM »
What's wrong with that photo is that is not a photo, it's a mosaic created with several photos and, apparently, a fake Sun, as that Sun doesn't look like any other Sun captured on Apollo missions' photos. The rightmost leg of the LM also looks fake, as photo AS11-40-5865 shows a different shadow and some lens flares.

The fact that this is a mosaic makes it easier to have a photo where the light is not the same in all elements of the mosaic.

The photo that shows the astronaut exiting the LM doesn't have the Sun pointing at it directly, so that photo was taken with different settings, showing what was in the shadow (but not in the dark, as the Moons' surface reflects the light, as we can see here on Earth) better than in a photo with a light source pointing to the camera.

Photo AS11-40-5863HR, showing the astronaut exiting the LM.


In photo AS11-40-5866, if there was another light source, the shadow of the astronaut should be projected onto the LM's entrance, unless it was a large, indirect light source, like the light reflected by the ground.


In photo AS11-40-5867 we can see a slight diffuse shadow of a tube on the astronaut's back, consistent with the light reflected by the ground.



On photo AS11-40-5862 (not used in the mosaic) we can see that there aren't any direct shadows, the light reaching up to the astronaut and the LM looks indirect.



The Apollo 11 Lunar Surface Journal says that this mosaic was created by a Ed Hengeveld. I sent him an e-mail yesterday but I haven't had an answer, at least not yet. :)

deuem

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #27 on: July 01, 2012, 08:00:04 AM »
I am sorry to ask but I never got as far as stating anything about the backpack or anything about the photo yet. Just the reasons there could be light. That is all, no more. I am still working on my other results.
 
I posted 7 reasons why there could be light, can anyone add more or dis-count any of the 7.
 
I see all Apollo photos with 5 natural reasons and at least 2 added reasons for light.

Offline ArMaP

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #28 on: July 01, 2012, 08:11:44 AM »
Reflected light is diffuse and would not create that degree of contrast.
That depends on the camera settings, a camera taking a photo of a highly reflective white suit in the shadow, with a somewhat reflective grey ground extending behind it could take a photo looking like that with no problems.

deuem

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Re: marcus allen and the nasa pics
« Reply #29 on: July 01, 2012, 08:54:14 AM »
Moon Photo AS11-40-5863-69 Posted by Zorgon



The Original as posted by Zorgon.



Night time: done as a test, others show more


Mid Range: This process is a good one and it will point out all of the items I am talking about lower in this post.


Full range: Kind of speaks for itself. I do like the yellow circle and arrow. Nice touches.



Impossible: With color burning a layer the Astronaut should have disappeared.



Close up of burn, Again this should be all dark by removing all light. It is still as bright or brighter than the sun is.



Many Questions: I have only added 14 numbers on the photo here of questions, there are even more.

1)      Strange light pattern behind dish with no accounting for it.
2)      Out gassing from a light
3)      Another back flash from unknown source
4)      A ring or tube piece left on the ground, where did this come from
5)      Unexplained shadow under the nozzle
6)      Looks like 2 probes
7)      C&P line for sure
8 )      Miss connection of photo
9)      The one and only reflection I found. See lower photos
10)  The Suns ray extend in front of the Lm. Impossible to do
11)  Questionable rock. Giving me a false shadow color ( minor, maybe me )
12)  The suns rays do not stop like this, they should fill the entire sky and it has been washed clean.
13)  If you lay in lines from that Sun to the shadow lines you find they don’t match very well
14)  No sun rays found on the surface besides 15
15)  The actual line for the sun which is missing

All in all this photo has been highly manipulated to the point I cant tell if it started off as real or not. It could very likely be a set piece made up for publicity photos. There is so much out of place I had a hard time figuring out where to start.


1 reflection: I looked all over the photo for a good reflection and this is the best one



1 reflection worked: Once the refection is processed it does look like it could have come from a sun, not the one in the photo. A flash should come out more black and white. This very small point of light has a lot of power. It is highly possible that with the original sun this is a bounce off the lens. The angles would work out better.



Ladder stuff: I want to take a look at the ladder right under his right foot. It looks to me that the toe of his right boot is showing under the ladder rung. Not connected to this foot but a different shot. So the ladder rung was a cut point and they missed the toe. oops



Toe: When taking the tip of the toe off the bottom and the rest of the shoe off the top and adding them together and processing them they have patterns that are identical and unlike the ladder rung. So his foot was in a different position in one photo and they missed it. I only caught it after processing it and it had a different pattern and color.



Sun rings; I have done many sun rings and these are not up to par.



Sun in color burn to play with



More gassing: In one of the other close up works I noticed what looks like there is some type of out gassing coming from the docking light. I can not figure this one out. Like hot air coming straight out.


Out gassing: This is another close up of what looks like out gassing.




Face in the ring: This one is for fun or it is a big problem. If you follow that gas above back to the light. The white donut, Ad then balance the photo just right, a face begins to show up in the inside of the ring. Rather it is a fluke of lighting or a real person it is quite interesting. If you look carefully you can make out all the facial details. The left ear and inside rings, 2 eyes hair line, nose mouth and chin. On the mouth you can see both lips closed and the head is slightly tilted down and to the left. By the size of the Astronauts it would seem to be correct. I am not one for seeing faces but this one did pop out. Have fun at it. Note the photo posted has lost some of the lightness and is darker than the original.



Deuem

 


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