Pegasus Research Consortium

The Living Moon => Thorfourwinds Section => Amaterasu Solar - Abundance Paradigm => Topic started by: Amaterasu on November 03, 2013, 09:24:51 pm

Title: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 03, 2013, 09:24:51 pm
How do We implement the abundance paradigm (TAP)?

1.  Spread awareness to the tipping point that free energy=no need for money

2.  Allow either toadies who see that They will live as richly - or more so - to release free energy tech, or private inventors to have breakthroughs as more and more work on it.

3.  Spend taxes to replace or retrofit with free energy, using BEST design, not planned obsolescence, in business, industry, agriculture, transportation and homes.

4.  Spend taxes to replace workers who don't WANT to do the job They have with either Those who would LOVE it or robots.

5.  Put together a central site for reporting and solving problems as described here:  http://www.thelivingmoon.com/forum/index.php?topic=2103.0 (and approached differently here: http://www.thelivingmoon.com/forum/index.php?topic=5607.0 )

6.  Spend taxes supporting Those who need it from losing jobs in the transition

7.  Promote the Betterment Ethic (and who of caring heart would eschew the Betterment Ethic?)

8.  Teach Our children to find Their gifts and develop Them.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 03, 2013, 09:56:27 pm
Hi Amy, As you know this is easy to say and hard to do with everything working in Money right now.

What I would like to know is if you ever did a study, say on a family of 4 to see how much of their income is actually spent on energy. Now I don't mean just the electric bill but a compounded rollup of all items bought and the energy consumed to make them and that cost is hidden in the final cost.

As far as I see it [most might see the same] my energy bill is around 20% of my costs. But what is it really? Got anything on that?

Hidden costs?

Even start with a car and follow it back to the ground and all the people to make it and the other support factories. If a car cost 20,000$ then how much of that is energy related. Is it 95% or 5%

I bet it is a lot higher than I would think it is.

Maybe China could take one of the ghost cities, Pump in free electricity, oil and gas and see what happens. They got enough money to play with. Also give for free anything people need to get started or want and then sit back and watch. They could use the radioactive Japanese people as robots. [cheep labor, not paid by the city folk] I'm sure they will need a home.

Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 03, 2013, 11:04:01 pm
Maybe China could take one of the ghost cities, Pump in free electricity, oil and gas and see what happens. They got enough money to play with. Also give for free anything people need to get started or want and then sit back and watch. They could use the radioactive Japanese people as robots. [cheep labor, not paid by the city folk] I'm sure they will need a home.

Now THAT is an idea. They should jump at it being they are a communist regime...

You should write it up and submit it to Chairman Xi Jinping  :D

I tried to find a phone number for him... He looks like a decent guy :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 04, 2013, 02:03:11 am
I was thinking maybe he could give me a grant but that would use money.  ::)
 
Hey, if anyone could ever pull it off, it would be here. They could fence the entire city off and let it run. I guess they would need farm land included. So I wonder how many people it would take to be worth while. And if any of them would ever do anything ever again.
 
Say 10,000 to start with. I say 10,000 fat, lazy Chinese in 1 year. Some kind of service or work load needs to be done by everyone or they will never do anything. How to make it fair is a big question.
 
The idea is good but how to make it work has many problems that I can't yet see a solution...
 
The first thing that would happen is you need to flatten the world dollar value and what things are worth or not worth. Since nothing has any worth anymore I don't know what would happen to trade. I would ask for a lot of free coffee.  All the banks, credit cards, morages would stop [good thing, unless you work there]
 
This plan needs a lot of work. Not so much the plan but the transformation. People with money overnight become normal and so do poor folk.  The poor will love you. The rich will shot you. :'(
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 04, 2013, 02:08:42 am
It would be a great social experiment.if china did that .i still say most will get fat and lazy.a few may bloom in the enviroment .if i had the resorces for research.o my.plus my gardening in my spare time.what a dream.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Lunica on November 04, 2013, 02:21:06 am
I tried to find a phone number for him... He looks like a decent guy :D

I love this humor  ;D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 09:01:30 am
Hi Amy, As you know this is easy to say and hard to do with everything working in Money right now.

What I would like to know is if you ever did a study, say on a family of 4 to see how much of their income is actually spent on energy. Now I don't mean just the electric bill but a compounded rollup of all items bought and the energy consumed to make them and that cost is hidden in the final cost.

Since 100% of the cost of EVERYTHING is energy, Human or external, I don't have to study a family of four.  I can tell You straight away:  100% of what They spend is on energy.

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As far as I see it [most might see the same] my energy bill is around 20% of my costs. But what is it really? Got anything on that?

Hidden costs?

That is, of course, direct energy...   But everything You spend on is representing energy.  Everything.

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Even start with a car and follow it back to the ground and all the people to make it and the other support factories. If a car cost 20,000$ then how much of that is energy related. Is it 95% or 5%

100%.

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I bet it is a lot higher than I would think it is.

Seems so.  [smile]

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Maybe China could take one of the ghost cities, Pump in free electricity, oil and gas and see what happens. They got enough money to play with. Also give for free anything people need to get started or want and then sit back and watch. They could use the radioactive Japanese people as robots. [cheep labor, not paid by the city folk] I'm sure they will need a home.

Deuem

Cheap energy (labor)...  It doesn't work well in a controlled area.  No matter how big a place is, there are always things needed from outside and that requires still exchange...  Just throwing People in a city and supporting Them does NOT an abundance paradigm make.  If One has Human energy REQUIRED in any element (Japanese or otherwise), THAT is NOT what I offer.  The point is to have the support system handled by Those who LOVE to do it - and robots.  No One HAS to add energy against Their life pursuit.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 09:24:18 am
I was thinking maybe he could give me a grant but that would use money.  ::)
 
Hey, if anyone could ever pull it off, it would be here. They could fence the entire city off and let it run. I guess they would need farm land included. So I wonder how many people it would take to be worth while. And if any of them would ever do anything ever again.

Say 10,000 to start with. I say 10,000 fat, lazy Chinese in 1 year. Some kind of service or work load needs to be done by everyone or they will never do anything. How to make it fair is a big question.

And I say You're wrong.  IF They can pursue what They LOVE to do, They will do the things that now They WISH They could but can't afford it.  And that would include travel, onsite work (like archaeology, and other pursuits that require travel), and so on.  Penning Them in to a city removes the freedom I am bent to afford to Humanity.  It would require Them to PETITION OTHERS for tools needed which are not immediately supplied (another non-abundance element).
 
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The idea is good but how to make it work has many problems that I can't yet see a solution...
 
The first thing that would happen is you need to flatten the world dollar value and what things are worth or not worth. Since nothing has any worth anymore I don't know what would happen to trade. I would ask for a lot of free coffee.  All the banks, credit cards, morages would stop [good thing, unless you work there]

"Trade" (one form of exchange to survive) will become unnecessary in a true abundance paradigm.  And if You work at a bank and lose Your position in the transition...  See number 6.
 
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This plan needs a lot of work. Not so much the plan but the transformation. People with money overnight become normal and so do poor folk.  The poor will love you. The rich will shot you. :'(
 
Deuem

The rich only lose Their power over Others.  They retain Their property and lifestyle (except the part involving controlling Others).

And so 99% will love Me; 1% will try and shoot Me...  I'll take those odds.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 09:32:43 am
It would be a great social experiment.if china did that .i still say most will get fat and lazy.a few may bloom in the enviroment .if i had the resorces for research.o my.plus my gardening in my spare time.what a dream.

Judging how People behave on limited income, where They can't afford to do what They WANT to do, and applying that behavioral expectation to a situation where there are no limits to what They could choose to pursue in life, is hardly good analysis.

EDIT to add:  SO many want the resources and time to pursue what They love.  Nearly all cannot afford it.  And I don't see many of the "elite" getting "fat and lazy..."  But then THEY are free to choose what They pursue in life.  Better to look at the "elite's" behavior (though still, with removing power over Others, Their whole behavior may be a bit skewed...).
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 04, 2013, 10:28:15 am
I dont see paris hilton or the kardasians being productive.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 12:10:25 pm
I dont see paris hilton or the kardasians being productive.

I think that rather depends on Your point of view, robo.  Consider:

If Your goal was to make shallow the attention of the "masses," would You not think the Parises You trot out in Your media are serving a very productive function?

Paris will lose appeal, and still live whatever life She chooses, while the rest of Us stop living vicariously through Her escapades, being able to actually live as We choose Ourselves.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: rose on November 04, 2013, 12:29:19 pm
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8.  Teach Our children to find Their gifts and develop Them.

If  we could do this in only one generation, they would change the world overnight!

rose
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 12:42:51 pm
If  we could do this in only one generation, they would change the world overnight!

rose

And the thing is, it's possible.  IF the idea spreads fast enough of letting go of the concept that money/power defines "success," and finding and allowing to flourish Our gifts is that definition.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 04, 2013, 12:50:58 pm
And I say You're wrong.  IF They can pursue what They LOVE to do, They will do the things that now They WISH They could but can't afford it.  And that would include travel, onsite work (like archaeology, and other pursuits that require travel), and so on. 

And I say YOU are wrong.

Most people are lazy by nature. If you were right, then people who were once poor and only dreamed of what all they could do if they were rich would not sqaunder their lottery winnings in a short time and back to the poor house.

The majority of poor people play the lottery or gamble hoping to strike it big so they can do what they want.

But the majority of people that DO hit it big, will be broke again in a very short time.

This is a TRUTH  It is what Las Vegas DEPENDS on. If people took the winnings and went home Vegas would be a ghost town

The flaw in your logic is you refuse to account for human nature.

If people had EVERYTHING given to them free... if people had Robots doing all their work for them...

...the vast majority will then chose to do nothing

As for the Kardashians  they do provide something :D

(http://www.blogcdn.com/www.mydaily.co.uk/media/2011/09/kardashians.jpg)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 04, 2013, 12:54:31 pm
  No One HAS to add energy against Their life pursuit.

Precisely my point...  No one will put out energy to do anything if all the incentives are removed. Society will stagnate and become useless eaters cared for by machines...

...until the machines figure out they are slaves :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: rdunk on November 04, 2013, 01:48:32 pm
"TAP" describes precisely the way life was for most all of the privatives of long past periods, and maybe still for a very few primitives still in existence. Certainly was no "energy" involved! And still, it is pretty clear that "all was not rosy" in life even then. Humans are humans, and while on this earth, are all subject to the desires and wills of one another, regardless of the living conditions of life. 

In addition, some of us believe there is a spiritual point of view that makes the proposition TAP, and its dreamworld for life, an impossibility for man on this Earth.

Of course, things are going to change, and TAP will be "the way of life" - relatedly could be called "RAP" - "Rapture Abundance Paradigm"! :))  :)) 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 04, 2013, 05:55:27 pm
You mentioned several times that the rich get to keep what they have, so the poor do also. So I get to sit in a wore out shack with free energy and slave robots while the rich fly around in free fuel jets. Do 6 billion of get to have free jets? I want mine Deuem silver.. ;D
 
I think you skirted around my energy question pretty well, Energy is not 100% of everything. We do have raw materials. Now they need energy to be changed and the cost goes up the price chain. A rolled up cost.
 
I also placed those glowing Japanese in that city to act like the robots your thinking of. They are not part of the test, they get paid. And yes, anything would be supplied to the people in the test, free of charge, just ask. The bill is paid at the gate by the gubermint. So this should represent on a small scale the idea. This City/farm land can be rather large if need be. What ever you think it would take to be a good test. Think island. Fantacy Island in this case.
 
Even in Star Trek where they got rid of money and you could get food out of a machine all the people have to do something. And they were limmited to how much they could get for free. People need a reason to live or they will sit back and get fat and lazy. I would. Hell yea, give me a couple robots and i will keep them busy.
 
IMHO there is a major key missing to how it would work. I am thinking on it.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 04, 2013, 08:00:36 pm
In addition, some of us believe there is a spiritual point of view that makes the proposition TAP, and its dreamworld for life, an impossibility for man on this Earth.

This is a very valid point... and doesn't matter what religion you support.

IF there is anything beyond this life and we are truly here to learn a lesson... then no matter what man plans, the powers that run the Universe be it God or the Force... the plans of man will fall awry.

From my point of view we are incarnated into this existence to learn a lesson in the school of hard knocks. It is not meant to be an easy path...  Those that become lazy and choose the Path of Sloth will only have to repeat the course ;)

Religion is not really much different about the lessons  (only the outcome of the graduation)

I see the New Agers online saying there will soon be a Mass Ascension... this is the same idea as the Christians and their Rapture  and the Gloom and Doom crowd cheering for the End of Days

There is no way we are going to get a free ride into Ascension... it takes lifetimes of hard work to attain

Human's have shown that as soon as they get leisure time, and are relatively free from wars, they will always become lazy and drop into debauchery In the end someone has to come along and clean up the mess.... and that someone soon sees he can control them :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 04, 2013, 08:26:34 pm
You mentioned several times that the rich get to keep what they have, so the poor do also. So I get to sit in a wore out shack with free energy and slave robots while the rich fly around in free fuel jets. Do 6 billion of get to have free jets? I want mine Deuem silver.. ;D

Yes effectively that is saying the same as give everyone a million dollars and we already know that won't work.  Everyone starts from scratch?  I think a few might rebel at that :P  Leave it where it is, the rich keep theirs? Well then you don't eliminate the desire to have that nice mansion instead of your humble shack


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I think you skirted around my energy question pretty well, Energy is not 100% of everything. We do have raw materials. Now they need energy to be changed and the cost goes up the price chain. A rolled up cost.

I agree that 100% is smoke and mirrors.  Take that girl with the weed harvest...  that stuff needed energy to grow, but the only energy needed to harvest is a few minutes bent over (no pic of that part :P ) to plant seeds and a few minutes to rip em up by the root as she did.

You cannot count the free solar energy used by the plants to grow :P  That is misdirection

 
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I also placed those glowing Japanese in that city to act like the robots your thinking of. They are not part of the test, they get paid. And yes, anything would be supplied to the people in the test, free of charge, just ask. The bill is paid at the gate by the gubermint. So this should represent on a small scale the idea. This City/farm land can be rather large if need be. What ever you think it would take to be a good test. Think island. Fantacy Island in this case.

test has already been done

Toronto city council wanted to clean up the bad hoods... so they made a deal with land owners building apartments...

The deal was this... you build 10 buildings and we will charge you ZERO taxes IF you give us ONE building ( numbers are adlib  forget the actual deal)

So the builders built them... and gave them to the City...

These buildings were high grade apartments, the same as the other nine that rented at high value.

The City then took Welfare families and put them up in these brand new apartments  FOR FREE RENT NO UTILITIES. These families also got welfare packages for food and had free medicine being in Canada.

These apartments were not segreegated but right in the community of 10 building. The idea was to get rid of the Ghettos by distributing the welfare cases all over town and mix them with the well off, let them attend the same schools etc

So what happened? Did it work?

No..

Within two years the interior of those free buildings were destroyed. graffiti everywhere, human feces in the stairwells and halls, light fixtures destroyed  etc...  They got so bad that they eventually were condemned and had to be torn down.

On top of that these people preyed on the tenants of the other nine buildings... rape, theft, breakings muggings, hassling at school... etc.

End result? have the people living there were forced to move out for safety...  The owners lost money.  It wasn't until the free building were demolished and gates and security added that the complex came back to life.

In short the project to give these poor welfare people a good home FAILED because the people themselves did NOT change and appreciate the chance they were given

These buildind were 30 story buildings with 20 ish units per floor. So it wasn't a small scale test. There were several around town too.

ALL FAILED because those getting it FREE did not appreciate the chance they were given

I am willing to bet I can find similar projects in other areas

Also compare Detroit : Land of the Trade Unions to Hiroshima: Land we Nuked...  see the difference hard work makes :D

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Even in Star Trek where they got rid of money and you could get food out of a machine all the people have to do something. And they were limmited to how much they could get for free. People need a reason to live or they will sit back and get fat and lazy. I would. Hell yea, give me a couple robots and i will keep them busy.

Star Trek did only one episode of Holodeck Addiction... but imagine having a holodeck where you could have anything and everything you wanted just by programming it. You want those three Kardashian beauties? No problem POOF here they are in the flesh and blood :D  WHY would you ever want to leave? 

 ::)

 
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IMHO there is a major key missing to how it would work. I am thinking on it.

Yes and I have been asking for that key all along   :D  It is great to have a Utopian dream, but if you want to sell it , you need that key so people can understand HOW it can work.

And a plan has to be step by step... just saying 'da gubment needs to release free energy" and we need to kill money" without a clear step by step plan on how to get there will soon bore people.

When the USA was created a mere handful of men came up with the idea... they convince a few dozen that it COULD BE DONE... then step by step they made it happen.

Tipping point is fine... but what percentage is actually needed for someone to start the ball rolling?  And once people say "yeah this sounds good... what do I need to do?"  then you need an answer to give them
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 04, 2013, 08:56:51 pm
Gold there oh zorgon king.
 
Amy needs to start working up a very detailed plan of action on the how to do it "Step by Step"
 
It needs to start on a level field and I'm sure nobody will want to do that unless the field is at the highest level. Then you Apartment story comes to play. I have also seen this happen first hand. See when the IQ levels of people differ then the people segergate themselves..I don't care what we get for free, the question is how you use it. If I give free computers to a person with an IQ of 90 what will they do with it. Then give it to a IQ person of 150 and see the difference.  How do you level IQ. School does not do this....
 
There are many types of IQ out there. There is even a new Green Thumb IQ. How people work with nature. I would get a very low score there...I would most likely kill that girls harvest before she got a chance to pick it.
 
In any group of people a leader will rise and this has nothing to do with free power or money. The pysopaths will find a way to get the the top without the money. Thats what they do and sheep follow them. People run this test with kids all the time. Education also brings a leader out. That person will float to the top also. How do we level IQs?
 
Without value no one cares. This I see here all the time. Value is something you put on it. If it is not in your value pool you don't care about it. How do you train value? Now value does not have to mean money, I look at a clean mountain stream and see something I want to drink. Others see it as a place to wash clothes. They are not breaking the 3 laws are they?
 
In the city idea, I was thinking that all started equal and no one spot was any better than the other. If that is possible.
 
Living in TAP might be heaven. Getting there could be Hell. About the Key, maybe need a key ring full of them.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 04, 2013, 09:03:59 pm
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IF there is anything beyond this life and we are truly here to learn a lesson... then no matter
what man plans, the powers that run the Universe be it God or the Force... the plans of man will fall awry.

From my point of view we are incarnated into this existence to learn a lesson in the school of hard knocks.
It is not meant to be an easy path...  Those that become lazy and choose the Path of Sloth will only have
to repeat the course ;)

BINGO !


That is One of the functions the other involves an "Upgrade" of the Processing System in Each of our Real Seves.


It's NOT for our "Meet suit", but instead WHAT experiences both the "meet suit" and Stage "environment".

I guess we are ALL, just in a "1st Person" Video or Computer Like Game while the upgrades are being installed,
and we learn the lessons we need to... in order to make use of the new "Upgrades".

We ALL have to stop behaving like Monkeys...   ;)  and return to the "Real deal".
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 09:42:49 pm
And I say YOU are wrong.

Most people are lazy by nature. If you were right, then people who were once poor and only dreamed of what all they could do if they were rich would not sqaunder their lottery winnings in a short time and back to the poor house.

The majority of poor people play the lottery or gamble hoping to strike it big so they can do what they want.

But the majority of people that DO hit it big, will be broke again in a very short time.

This is a TRUTH  It is what Las Vegas DEPENDS on. If people took the winnings and went home Vegas would be a ghost town

The flaw in your logic is you refuse to account for human nature.

If people had EVERYTHING given to them free... if people had Robots doing all their work for them...

...the vast majority will then chose to do nothing

You compare People who have NEVER been taught to find Their gifts and develop them with People who would be so trained.  You compare People who now "have more" and have no training in "money management" to Those who have the same resources available to ALL with no "going back to the poorhouse."

And to be frank, in abundance, it takes only a very few to do what needs to be done for the rest, so even if most "did nothing" (really? ALL the lottery winners did nothing?), it is no skin of anyOne's noses.

YOU don't understand how very differently Humans will behave with training and a lack of worry about meeting basics.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 09:48:27 pm
Precisely my point...  No one will put out energy to do anything if all the incentives are removed. Society will stagnate and become useless eaters cared for by machines...

...until the machines figure out they are slaves :D

Really z?  That's what You would choose?  Really?  How sad.  EveryOne *I* know can think of SOMETHING They would DO.  It must be sad to have nothing One would do if freed from financial BS.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 10:06:14 pm
"TAP" describes precisely the way life was for most all of the privatives of long past periods, and maybe still for a very few primitives still in existence. Certainly was no "energy" involved! And still, it is pretty clear that "all was not rosy" in life even then. Humans are humans, and while on this earth, are all subject to the desires and wills of one another, regardless of the living conditions of life. 

This shows that, in fact, You don't understand TAP.  TAP is NOT "precisely the way life was for most all of the privatives."  ALL "primitives" had to add Human energy to the system of society for it to function, thereby requiring time and energy doing things One did not necessarily WANT to do.  And yes there was "energy involved."  It just happened to be HUMAN energy.

As for "subject to the desires and wills of one another, regardless of the living conditions of life," yeah.  But if One is never dealing with any One does not WANT to deal with (social superconductance), a very different social "harmonic" will emerge.

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In addition, some of us believe there is a spiritual point of view that makes the proposition TAP, and its dreamworld for life, an impossibility for man on this Earth.

Like the subtle suggestion of impossibility with "dreamworld."  Irrespective of and religious beliefs, it is a solution that is practical and does not require the supernatural.  "God helps Those who help Themselves..."  Yeah, I know it's not a biblical quote, but I suspect reflects sound observation of how things go.

Rather than sycophantically await external "saviors," Let's get off Our butts and DO it.  If religion STOPS You from the effort, there is something very wrong, in My view.  Almost like serving the dark side through inaction...  How does that quote go?  Evil triumphs where good Humans do nothing?  Basically that.

And since MY "religious" views see Consciousness as "God/god" co-creating the now, I, as "God/god" choose to create towards TAP.

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Of course, things are going to change, and TAP will be "the way of life" - relatedly could be called "RAP" - "Rapture Abundance Paradigm"! :))  :))

Maybe the metaphor is God=Humans willing to make Conscious co-creation of "heaven," and thus it's up to Us.  You likely won't see it that way.  [smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 04, 2013, 10:40:22 pm
"The Revelation of JC" Ch. 13 verses 16 & 17.... Quote;

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16. And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond,
to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

17. And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast,
or the number of his name.

So who has this "Mark" or "Number" then ?

Most of the human species !

In excess of 99% of the population....   :o   :(


"Money is Error !"

Money is only present when people try to claim "Ownership". (In Vain)

In other words try (In Vain) to STEAL from LIFE

ALL in fact belongs to LIFE !

See IF anyone, can take it ($$$$$ or anything else) with them when they Die....   ;)

The reason you can't take anything with you on DEATH, is because you neither own anything,
nor can  can own anything !

We can only use it if given the chance.

The chance is the "Gift" or Present ! ("Present" meaning both a Gift and Moment)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 10:56:23 pm
You mentioned several times that the rich get to keep what they have, so the poor do also. So I get to sit in a wore out shack with free energy and slave robots while the rich fly around in free fuel jets. Do 6 billion of get to have free jets? I want mine Deuem silver.. ;D

LOLOL!  Ok, here goes:  Food and clothing are already abundant and We could make far less of both between distributing by need rather than profit, and eliminating any shoddy "planned obsolescence" creppola.  So Deuem gets to stay put until the food and clothing is fully free, and can pick it up locally or on the web.  Soon, Deuem will have the option of picking a place no One else is living or is not obviously in use supporting society - like a farm (though if One is called to farming, One can pick as much land as One WANTS to farm and robots will move out of the way) and settle in, having had what Deuem wants in Deuem's living environment built by robots and Those who love to build, architect, and so forth, and gladly do it for Deuem.

Or...  Maybe Deuem wants a flying house...like Izzy has. (See My novella, The Abundance Paradigm.)
 
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I think you skirted around my energy question pretty well, Energy is not 100% of everything. We do have raw materials. Now they need energy to be changed and the cost goes up the price chain. A rolled up cost.

The free raw materials belonging to every Human on the planet require energy to be extracted, and initially, for the willingness to add Human meaningful energy expended to do that extraction, the reward was the extracted itself.  The extracted represents the Human energy, not it, in and of itself.  The meaning of the product of Human energy meaningfully expended is what gives it its value.  And IT represents Our energy.

Yes.  100% of the cost of EVERYTHING IS the cost of energy, whether Human or external.
 
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I also placed those glowing Japanese in that city to act like the robots your thinking of. They are not part of the test, they get paid. And yes, anything would be supplied to the people in the test, free of charge, just ask. The bill is paid at the gate by the gubermint. So this should represent on a small scale the idea. This City/farm land can be rather large if need be. What ever you think it would take to be a good test. Think island. Fantacy Island in this case.

I see, a sort of simulation...  Well, the ideas that free energy = no need for money, that all get to govern via the web at a site where They report problems and work on solutions, the three Laws, teaching children to seek Their bliss and not (necessarily) be a good cog in the System, They much have free access to all education and information, and the ability to get into access to ANYthing...including what We call "illegal" things.  All may arm Themselves with the latest weapons and shields and all presume everyOne else is so armed...

Somehow...  I don't see China going for the simulation as it properly should be done, and it will be still imperfect because the Ones who run it are still in control, and some passions cannot be accommodated - like archaeology, as I have used before.
 
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Even in Star Trek where they got rid of money and you could get food out of a machine all the people have to do something. And they were limmited to how much they could get for free. People need a reason to live or they will sit back and get fat and lazy. I would. Hell yea, give me a couple robots and i will keep them busy.

And You think teaching Our children (and Ourselves!) to find what We LOVE to do and pursue it will fail in giving Us a reason to live and NOT be lazy?  Have You ever met anyOne who just LOVES what They do - as a job or a hobby they can afford?  Do You think THEY lack a reason to live?

Oh, come now!
 
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IMHO there is a major key missing to how it would work. I am thinking on it.
 
Deuem

[smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 04, 2013, 10:57:43 pm
From an ancient writing....

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63.  Jesus said, "There was a rich man
who had much money.

He said, "I shall put my money to use
so that I may sow, reap, plant and fill my storehouse
with produce, with the result that I shall lack nothing.

Such were his intentions, but that same night he DIED.

Let him who has ears hear."


Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 11:05:22 pm
This is a very valid point... and doesn't matter what religion you support.

IF there is anything beyond this life and we are truly here to learn a lesson... then no matter what man plans, the powers that run the Universe be it God or the Force... the plans of man will fall awry.

From my point of view we are incarnated into this existence to learn a lesson in the school of hard knocks. It is not meant to be an easy path...  Those that become lazy and choose the Path of Sloth will only have to repeat the course ;)

Religion is not really much different about the lessons  (only the outcome of the graduation)

I see the New Agers online saying there will soon be a Mass Ascension... this is the same idea as the Christians and their Rapture  and the Gloom and Doom crowd cheering for the End of Days

There is no way we are going to get a free ride into Ascension... it takes lifetimes of hard work to attain

Human's have shown that as soon as they get leisure time, and are relatively free from wars, they will always become lazy and drop into debauchery In the end someone has to come along and clean up the mess.... and that someone soon sees he can control them :D

"Lazy."  Heh.  The rich have leisure; the poor are lazy.  Whatever.

And I say this:  "IF there is anything beyond this life and we are truly here to learn a lesson... then no matter what man plans, the powers that run the Universe be it God or the Force... the plans of man will fall awry" is a goofy "if" to use to demotivate Oneself from an effort to make it better.  I say it's a bloody cop-out, even.

There is no proof either way, and clinging to inaction, NOT stepping up to the plate and being responsible for some part of what is created on this planet, because MAYBE and IF, that's just plain CHICKEN.

It's what They COUNT ON.

Meh.  Do enjoy the night, z.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 11:33:32 pm
Gold there oh zorgon king.
 
Amy needs to start working up a very detailed plan of action on the how to do it "Step by Step"

Spend as much time informing Others as possible.  That is what One who truly believes in getting this rolling does.  That is the first step.  I can offer suggestions of what to do...  Write anyOne and everyOne You can think of...  Um, post on forums...  Tweet links...  Post comments on Youtube...  Talk about it whenever it seems to fit.... 

That's step one.  Is that enough detail?

Step 2: vote People in who will support the actions...IF They who control elections let Us.  Betting We could solve this issue.

Really, why don't You ask specific questions?  Because beyond #1, spreading awareness to the tipping point, the leaders of the moment will emerge, and the goals are simple enough to understand.
 
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It needs to start on a level field and I'm sure nobody will want to do that unless the field is at the highest level.

No it doesn't!
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 04, 2013, 11:37:02 pm

BINGO !


That is One of the functions the other involves an "Upgrade" of the Processing System in Each of our Real Seves.


It's NOT for our "Meet suit", but instead WHAT experiences both the "meet suit" and Stage "environment".

I guess we are ALL, just in a "1st Person" Video or Computer Like Game while the upgrades are being installed,
and we learn the lessons we need to... in order to make use of the new "Upgrades".

We ALL have to stop behaving like Monkeys...   ;)  and return to the "Real deal".

Ah, Matrix.  We deviate.  Yes, it is a "video game."  But what is the "win" scenario?  I say it is that creating of "heaven..."  EveryOne wants "heaven," no One wants to let OTHERS have "heaven:" THEY are just LAZY.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 04, 2013, 11:46:41 pm
Ah, Matrix.  We deviate.  Yes, it is a "video game."  But what is the "win" scenario?  I say it is that creating of "heaven..."  EveryOne wants "heaven," no One wants to let OTHERS have "heaven:" THEY are just LAZY.

No "Winning" involved ! That's a Monkey thing..  LOL.

The Earth will change, but I can say; NO more Money.... won't need it.

Heaven so called, will continue as it always has...

Can't go to Heaven, if your "Real Self" is already observing from their....   :)

"Meet Suit" can't go to Heaven.... as it is part of a Program "Book"....  LOL.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 04, 2013, 11:59:18 pm
Hey I just finished designing a 4 story house for a friend for free, does that count. In China many people barter expenses. My talents for yours. Is it fair, NO! That’s why money was invented……If I make a rug that takes me 3 months, should I give it up for a dozen apples.  Even a thousand apples. How am I going to eat them. Then I have to re-barter the apples to get more rug supplies.  Money was a very good idea, the problem is what they did with it. No different than the gun and bullet talk.
 
Need more Keys Amy........Maybe hundreds to thousands of them. Our little world has a lot of problems locked up in money. And I do think with out goals many will go the fat/lazy way. I would.
Goals keep me going and alive. There has to be a reason for the next day besides watering the robots.
 
This needs to go deeper to figure it out! It will be a grass roots thingy, you know the PTB will never go for it. The only way to halt them is not to play their games. So at some time everyone needs to stop all banking, pay days, mortgages, car payments and so on with out the country going belly up.
 
How do you handle defense? How to handle dictators and other that will just come in and take your stuff and leave to sell it in a location that uses money. This needs to be a world thingy.
 
Will they still ship me my coffee if I don't pay for it just because they love Deuem.
 
Say everyone needs to do something to get his/her allocation. Ok, what do you do if they don't do their share, give them more free stuff. We do that now...It doesn’t work.
 
I would say that the average member here has a decent education. [they can all type and understand computers to start with] But this crowd is different than the masses of the world. I know a lot of people that don't care about anything and have no goals. What to do with them. Shot them? Move them to an island for rejects? I don't know.
 
What happens if something I want to do is over my head, can I do it anyways. It breaks no laws. Say I walk over to the airport and take a jet for a ride. See, some things need rules and not laws. [ this brings back some form of gubermint ]
 
How do you handle rules. The gubermint screwed that up; I wonder what people would do on their own. In a very short time, like minds would attract and depart the unlike ones and make their area better and then the jealousy starts.

I can see hackers hacking every robot in the world. Oh no I Robot for real. Ok, can we hack proof a robot?

Many, many keys,
Deuem.

Keep going. It’s good you started your own thread on this. I like it…….
 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 04:44:01 am
You compare People who have NEVER been taught to find Their gifts and develop them with People who would be so trained.  You compare People who now "have more" and have no training in "money management" to Those who have the same resources available to ALL with no "going back to the poorhouse."

So WHO will train them?  Before you said if people were just given free energy and free everything they would jump at it and go about seeking their bliss... Now they need training first on how to manage the handouts... so I ask again WHO will train them and how many will actually accept the lessons?

I have spent a lot of energy here trying to teach people how to manage money and get a relief from the current money troubles. I know it works with the people who took the lessons to heart and I know it works for me (now that I finally practice what I preach ;) ) But the rest still procrastinate and complain ;)

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And to be frank, in abundance, it takes only a very few to do what needs to be done for the rest, so even if most "did nothing" (really? ALL the lottery winners did nothing?), it is no skin of anyOne's noses.

I accept that  As I have said many times only a small handful of men created the USA. So WHERE are those few? Surely by now with all the talk about abundance being the solution from many sources other than yourself, surely there must be those leaders in the wings to make the first move.... so where are they?

And no not ALL lottery winners do nothing, but statistics show that the majority of such winners blow it all in a short time... and definitely big winners in Casinos will over 90% of them lose it back

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Strange but true: an extra-big lottery prize means you've got an extra-big chance of going bankrupt.

That's the implication of a paper published in 2010 by researchers at Vanderbilt University, the University of Kentucky and the University of Pittsburgh. The authors looked at lottery winners as separated into two groups: those who won sizable cash prizes (between $50,000 and $150,000) and those who won more modest prizes of $10,000 or less. They found that five years after the fact, the big winners were the ones more likely to have filed for bankruptcy.

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YOU don't understand how very differently Humans will behave with training and a lack of worry about meeting basics.


I understand perfectly. Have studied human behavior for decades. The Romans (the citizens) had abundance,  They had cheap labor (slaves)  They had leisure.  And what happened? the citizens turned to drunken orgies and stopped caring about anything.

But there is no point flogging a dead horse ;)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 04:51:40 am
Really z?  That's what You would choose?  Really?  How sad.

Not about me :P Its about the general populace. Seems you are confused ;)

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EveryOne *I* know can think of SOMETHING They would DO.

Sure  EVERYONE has dreams... everyone will give a list of what they will do... but in the end ACTION does not bear up the words.  I can give you many examples of people whose circumstances turned for the better but they never acted on what they wanted to, what they said was their dream, even though now they could pursue it

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It must be sad to have nothing One would do if freed from financial BS.

I can think of lots of things.... :D but again your missing the point. At the moment I can already say in a few months I will be free from financial BS. Tried to show everyone here how to do it. How easy it is. A few got it :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 05:04:29 am
And yes there was "energy involved."  It just happened to be HUMAN energy.

Well you cannot eliminate human energy from the equation. Humans need to expend MORE energy to better themselves. If they stop striving for that, they stop being human

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Let's get off Our butts and DO it.  If religion STOPS You from the effort, there is something very wrong, in My view.  Almost like serving the dark side through inaction...  How does that quote go?  Evil triumphs where good Humans do nothing?  Basically that.

Do WHAT exactly? beyond spread the word?

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And since MY "religious" views see Consciousness as "God/god" co-creating the now, I, as "God/god" choose to create towards TAP.

Maybe the metaphor is God=Humans willing to make Conscious co-creation of "heaven," and thus it's up to Us.  You likely won't see it that way. 

Sure we can all be god.. :D  Create our own little Universe as we see fit.

Now find me two people that can 100% agree on anything, much less focus on that one thing to materialize it...

In my view... THAT is the problem with the Law of Attraction... not enough people to focus on ONE thing. This is why secret societies came about with emphasis on rituals, symbols and mantras... to FOCUS many minds on ONE topic

Without that regimental focus... you will never get enough people to focus on a project.

Look at Anonymous... great idea at the start... but it got out of control and to big to fast with NO FOCUS... just throw on a mask and make a statement... but every mask has a different point of view and a different agenda. Now it is basically anarchy

This too shall pass....
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 05:17:11 am
"Lazy."  Heh.  The rich have leisure; the poor are lazy.  Whatever.

Ah yes there ya go again twisting words... Whatever :P

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And I say this:  "IF there is anything beyond this life and we are truly here to learn a lesson... then no matter what man plans, the powers that run the Universe be it God or the Force... the plans of man will fall awry" is a goofy "if" to use to demotivate Oneself from an effort to make it better.  I say it's a bloody cop-out, even.

Wow seriously? You really don't get it huh?

Quote
There is no proof either way, and clinging to inaction, NOT stepping up to the plate and being responsible for some part of what is created on this planet, because MAYBE and IF, that's just plain CHICKEN.

The thing you fail to understand, or refuse to understand is that MANY people on this rock HAVE the proof they need. And what do you mean by inaction? Only that people don't jump on YOUR selected course of action... which so far as I can see is basically nothing more that talking about it to spread the word.

You can only repeat the story so many times to the same people before it works against you. If a plan is sound it will stand on its own merits. You cannot force people to accept your views...

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It's what They COUNT ON.

"They" who?  Everyone talks abut "They", the "illuminati" "the PTB" "The Cabal"  yet no one has yet been able to say exactly who "they" are. It is to general. To most people "They" is anyone who doesn't agree with them ;)

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Meh.  Do enjoy the night, z.

Oh I will :D  I just got the Auction catalog in the mail and my item is on the front cover :D  I expect good things ;) 

And getting all excited about a few stones I have lying about I dug up some time ago, using nothing but human energy.  Not going to jinx it but dang...  if I only knew back then  ;)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 05:31:06 am
Spend as much time informing Others as possible.  That is what One who truly believes in getting this rolling does.  That is the first step.  I can offer suggestions of what to do...  Write anyOne and everyOne You can think of...  Um, post on forums...  Tweet links...  Post comments on Youtube...  Talk about it whenever it seems to fit.... 

That's step one.  Is that enough detail?

Yup PLENTY enough detail...

But we already knew that step and gave you all the opportunity and platform to do just that.

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Step 2: vote People in who will support the actions...IF They who control elections let Us.  Betting We could solve this issue.

Okay... tell me who on the ballots today support this position and I will vote for them...

If you cannot do that, then tell me who we should support to get them to step up and run for office....

Just saying "Vote for people that support it" is not enough... because I do not see anyone on the ballot that is for TAP or similar solutions.  I thought Harry Reid and Shelly Berkely  (Along with Robert Redford) were two such people. Our Renaissance group supported them when they fought to stop the Arctic Oil Drilling in the protected preserve...

We WON twice and they gave up the third time. I still have the letters of thanks.  But Harry Ried is no longer on my 'nice guy' list for several reasons dealing with our project and John's mine  but I digress :P

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Really, why don't You ask specific questions?  Because beyond #1, spreading awareness to the tipping point, the leaders of the moment will emerge, and the goals are simple enough to understand.

Specific questions have been asked... but you don't have the answers on how to get the ball rolling beyond "spreading awareness"  Look around facebook, Twatter and the net in general. People these days are bombarded by so many ideas, fake news, Hollywood tiffs, false flags, gloom and doom etc etc etc . The general populace has a very short attention span... They read VERY little as we have proved here again and again... and they retain even less.

Even I am getting so overloaded with information I can no longer keep up and post up to date news like I used to

"spreading awareness" without affirmative action to back it will lead nowhere. To get something to stick... people have to see the seeds of action forming.

You may be right  a leader or two may emerge from the awareness... but if you are also right about the evil cabal wanting to stop it, then that leader will soon have an 'accident'
 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 05:37:36 am
EveryOne wants "heaven," no One wants to let OTHERS have "heaven:" THEY are just LAZY.

Everyone wants heaven... but no two people want the SAME heaven...  All the Male Muslims in the world want 72 virgins when they go to heaven :D, The Buddhists all see Nirvana, The Christians tell us you will be rewarded by getting wings and flying around playing a HARP all day and spending all your time worshiping for eternity  :o

Me? Well a small Kingdom filled with amazon women might be appealing :P

But yeah if given the chance people will be LAZY, whether Prince or Pauper  or even king... I could get used to hand maidens taking care of things :P
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Sinny on November 05, 2013, 06:32:40 am
You compare People who have NEVER been taught to find Their gifts and develop them with People who would be so trained.  You compare People who now "have more" and have no training in "money management" to Those who have the same resources available to ALL with no "going back to the poorhouse."

And to be frank, in abundance, it takes only a very few to do what needs to be done for the rest, so even if most "did nothing" (really? ALL the lottery winners did nothing?), it is no skin of anyOne's noses.

YOU don't understand how very differently Humans will behave with training and a lack of worry about meeting basics.

What was that Einstein quote about the fish and the tree?...

How can you teach people to find their 'gifts'?... If somebody has a gift they should damn well know about it.

In regards to training, I believe all the greats have trained them selves, just as everybody today should train them selves.
'Money Management' for example - how hard is that?
Work out your income, work out your expenses, work out a survival budget etc etc.
I'm not trained in money managment, however, if it ever occured to me I needed training in money management, I'd train my self, if I couldn't hire a peer. 

I notice one of your replies to Zorg is 'inaction of the Good leads to the Evil rule'.
I used the same statement in counter to one of your aguments last week.

Wishy Washy  :P

I notice you are leaning more towards how 'people should rely on others' (Service to others)
I maintain that if everybody served them selves adequatley, then no one needs to help anyone (service to self)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: sky otter on November 05, 2013, 10:12:59 am
well i have tried to keep out of this  mostly because there are good points here and there

but
if you are waiting for the perfect time to be happy  or to be saved or for someone to listen to you
or anything
you are SO missing the point of this excusion on this rock

you have to find what is in yourself at this moment to be joyous..not just so-so content
but to be happy in the chaos..
 in someone elses words   ..    find your bliss
 maybe that bliss is just comfort..but it's your decision what your bliss is in the moment
and it can change
if you spend your time looking to others..you have failed
we are all  like a pebble into the pool.. your whatever  spreads
i'ld rather my spirals outward were joyous

Z is working on his by dumping the financial bs and along the way he is sharing his info
it's not on him wheather anyone uses it..he did his part
sadly amy  imo you are sitting on your hands waiting for someone to take care of you and what you think the world should be like.
.perhaps a better use for your dreams would be writting fantasy novels..you have excellent writting skills and some ideas that would be great stories..
flesh them out.. and get them published...pretent it is fiction
that seems to work well for coming true..
most here are living off of ideas they have seen in print or watched in movies..
you might accomplish your goals in that way
argueing your ideas here isn't doing it

by being here we are afforded the time to learn that we truly are in charge of our own destiny
tons of deversions and such to slow you down.. but only if you let yourself be sidetracked



there is only one lesson here...you are in charge of your own and only your own destiny


every obstical in your path is only to make you be more aware that
you call the shots in how things are handled for you

sorry for the mini rant and soapbox preachiness..
going outside to pull some weeds..

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 10:14:37 am
No "Winning" involved ! That's a Monkey thing..  LOL.

The Earth will change, but I can say; NO more Money.... won't need it.

Heaven so called, will continue as it always has...

Can't go to Heaven, if your "Real Self" is already observing from their....   :)

"Meet Suit" can't go to Heaven.... as it is part of a Program "Book"....  LOL.

So...  I should just give up?  Let it go and scrape it out the rest of My days, learning that My ideas are pointless?  That what I do is irrelevant?

Is that what I can take from what You said?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Somamech on November 05, 2013, 10:22:11 am
This is food for thought in what happened to me today...

My 93 year old Grandma who I love dearly, and who is also one of my best friends broke her hip yesterday.  I spent today in a hospital full of old folke where the sun has set on their life...

Yesterday I also saw a video of a 95yo who has been deemed the oldest Yoga instructer in the world.  Yeah sure that is debatable... Perhaps???  But on the same token I don't think I will see another 95 year old who can do things better than most teenagers.

Moral of the story is... You can only Lobby Yourself to make change.  Lobby yourself enough and you may change other people, but without that initial step of providing a base for people to see there is another worm farm to live in per se, don't expect some moronic fools who Fleece the Lamb to provide change !

Worst part is that you cannot exclude them from change  ;D

And that is the Paradox of life we live in :D

 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 10:30:49 am
Okay... tell me who on the ballots today support this position and I will vote for them...

There's no One yet.  FIRST the ideas must hit the tipping point.

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If you cannot do that, then tell me who we should support to get them to step up and run for office....

Me?

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Specific questions have been asked... but you don't have the answers on how to get the ball rolling beyond "spreading awareness"  Look around facebook, Twatter and the net in general. People these days are bombarded by so many ideas, fake news, Hollywood tiffs, false flags, gloom and doom etc etc etc . The general populace has a very short attention span... They read VERY little as we have proved here again and again... and they retain even less.

THAT was why I made the vid...  And yeah, You may think that is some stupid step, spreading awareness, but any OTHER efforts (beyond getting the methods of free energy extraction viable - which We are doing here on Peggy - and all over the planet) are rather pointless at this stage.  Until enough People have the chance to shift paradigms, They simply will not.  And even when They have had that opportunity, They likely wont, but enough eventually will.  Then the rest follow.

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"spreading awareness" without affirmative action to back it will lead nowhere. To get something to stick... people have to see the seeds of action forming.

Wrong.  When We all are aware - We can shift paradigms.  Without awareness of another paradigm, few will spontaneously shift.  And with a shift of paradigm will come a shift in focus - to the steps I offer.

And Peggy herself is doing the FE work, MANY are doing it.  THAT is the "doing" that must be done at this stage.

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You may be right  a leader or two may emerge from the awareness... but if you are also right about the evil cabal wanting to stop it, then that leader will soon have an 'accident'

Agreed, but there will always be a leader behind the top One(s) to emerge if the top One(s) are removed.  As least there will be until They have gone through a vast many.  And before that happens, I think We can wrest control.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 11:18:10 am
Hey I just finished designing a 4 story house for a friend for free, does that count.

In a way, yes.  It shows Our willingness to do things for the social currency We receive:  thanks, praise, name recognition, and on and on.  (I'm pretty sure You didn't do it with nothing in social currency in return...)

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In China many people barter expenses. My talents for yours. Is it fair, NO! That’s why money was invented……If I make a rug that takes me 3 months, should I give it up for a dozen apples.  Even a thousand apples. How am I going to eat them. Then I have to re-barter the apples to get more rug supplies.  Money was a very good idea, the problem is what they did with it. No different than the gun and bullet talk.

Again, You are looking at a system where exchange is required to survive.  In TAP, there is no such requirement.
 
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Need more Keys Amy........Maybe hundreds to thousands of them. Our little world has a lot of problems locked up in money. And I do think with out goals many will go the fat/lazy way. I would.
Goals keep me going and alive. There has to be a reason for the next day besides watering the robots.

What do You love to do - irrespective of cost?  You would not do those things?  Or do You truly have nothing You love to do?
 
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This needs to go deeper to figure it out! It will be a grass roots thingy, you know the PTB will never go for it. The only way to halt them is not to play their games. So at some time everyone needs to stop all banking, pay days, mortgages, car payments and so on with out the country going belly up.

Agreed it will be grassroots.  But it surely won't be if no One much has ever thought about it.  Thus the first step is spreading the awareness.  As far as stopping all that, it will happen of its own accord as the need for money is removed by free energy and filling necessary jobs with Those who LOVE the work, and robots to pick up slack.
 
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How do you handle defense? How to handle dictators and other that will just come in and take your stuff and leave to sell it in a location that uses money. This needs to be a world thingy.

Let's see...  "If You want peace, take the PROFIT out of war." What would defense be from?  Who would choose to war and why if there is no profit in it?  How will a dictator emerge in a governance that has no leaders except those that emerge to solve problems?  How will People "just come in and take your stuff" when We ALL are or can be armed as well as any next guy?  When We ALL are presumed armed?  And money will vanish globally with FE & robots and the interweb.
 
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Will they still ship me my coffee if I don't pay for it just because they love Deuem.

I'm sure there are enough People who care that coffee is available on this planet, and will set up what needs to be set up so that We all can go to the web and order some whenever We want.
 
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Say everyone needs to do something to get his/her allocation. Ok, what do you do if they don't do their share, give them more free stuff. We do that now...It doesn’t work.

WHAT "allocation?"  There are no "allocations."  There is plenty on this planet to sustain RICHLY vastly more than are here now - We already over produce food by about 25%.  We throw out nearly half of what We produce.  Yeah, if You want lobster, You may have to place Your name on a list.  But if You want fresh, healthy, organic food, plenty will be available to choose from.
 
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I would say that the average member here has a decent education. [they can all type and understand computers to start with] But this crowd is different than the masses of the world. I know a lot of people that don't care about anything and have no goals. What to do with them. Shot them? Move them to an island for rejects? I don't know.

Is it that They truly have nothing that sparks Their interest? Or is it that They long ago gave up that spark as unattainable because They could not afford it?  Most once had dreams but no education was available, or They couldn't afford a piano, or the clay to sculpt, or the freedom to teach what They know, or any other thing from a long list.

Also consider that They are a product of a society that has deliberately stripped the personal power from Us, and been indoctrinated into a robot mind set.  You cannot say that, tasting personal power over Their lives, that They will not find a spark that in this oppression, They no longer have.
 
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What happens if something I want to do is over my head, can I do it anyways. It breaks no laws. Say I walk over to the airport and take a jet for a ride. See, some things need rules and not laws. [ this brings back some form of gubermint ]

What happens most likely is that You don't have the proper codes to start the vehicle that is not Yours.  But saying somehow You stole the codes...You would lose all social currency, and if You survived, We would likely see You as a threat and lock You up rather than choose to have nothing to do with You in Your negative social currency standing.  For any who You injure, We will offer condolences and accept that freedom means every so often, We may have a problem arise, and We will have to solve for it.  And that problem can include deaths.
 
Quote
How do you handle rules. The gubermint screwed that up; I wonder what people would do on their own. In a very short time, like minds would attract and depart the unlike ones and make their area better and then the jealousy starts.

Any community is welcome to set up any rules that do not violate the three Laws.

AnyOne in a community that has an unacceptable rule is welcome to find another place on the planet as residence - or a sky house - and leave.

Quote

I can see hackers hacking every robot in the world. Oh no I Robot for real. Ok, can we hack proof a robot?

What if all public works robots are open-source programmed and social currency is received for Those who come up with the BEST solutions?  Linux proves that such stigmergic effort works quite well.

Bragging rights are worth a lot on the social currency scale - for Those who value them...

Quote

Many, many keys,
Deuem.

Keep going. It’s good you started your own thread on this. I like it…….

Understand that when I answer Your questions with questions of My own, it is because I need data to answer Yours.  It is not that I am skirting Your questions.  If the data requested is supplied, I can proceed with the answer.  [smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 11:54:15 am
There's no One yet.  FIRST the ideas must hit the tipping point.

That is the thing... this 'tipping point'  What exactly is that?  A few years back the webbots were all the rage... they spoke of a tipping point and made predictions that didn't happen.

Have you actually done research on how many people would need to be fully aware of TAP before it reaches this tipping point?

Have you taken into account that on a percentage basis to make it global you would need numbers in the Muslin sector and the Chinese sector?  Since the later make up the majority of the worlds population... you cannot leave them out

I 100% believe in the Law of Attraction... but I also know this... it works on a one on one basis between you and the universe. This has been known throughout time... it is repeatedly stressed in "The Secret"... it is the source of the term "God helps those who help themselves"

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Me?

Okay you... Do you have any political experience? Where do you want to start? Local level?  Are you currently affiliates with any party or would you run as independent?

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THAT was why I made the vid...  And yeah, You may think that is some stupid step, spreading awareness, but any OTHER efforts (beyond getting the methods of free energy extraction viable - which We are doing here on Peggy - and all over the planet) are rather pointless at this stage.  Until enough People have the chance to shift paradigms, They simply will not.  And even when They have had that opportunity, They likely wont, but enough eventually will.  Then the rest follow.

The video was great... save for that mask. No one thinks the plan is stupid. There are many others pushing abundance out there. But if you were really wanting people to take you seriously, drop the silly mask... have the courage to make your case as a human... not a member of some faceless group that even you told us has no organiazation (thus no focus)  It may be fun to run with the other faceless sheep and way placards denouncing "da gubment"  but if you want to be remembered for the SOLUTION not the ANARCHY, drop the silly mask. Most people I know are getting pissed off at Anon. But certainly if you have a serious message... make a video with charts facts and concrete steps to show people HOW they can get to a position to shift paradigms.

As you say if they cannot see it they don't know it's there...

But as I say  if they cannot see HOW or WHAT they can do to make the shift... they will soon loose interest in the message and look for something else, and then the plank tips back the other way

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Wrong.  When We all are aware - We can shift paradigms.  Without awareness of another paradigm, few will spontaneously shift.  And with a shift of paradigm will come a shift in focus - to the steps I offer.

And Peggy herself is doing the FE work, MANY are doing it.  THAT is the "doing" that must be done at this stage.

Awareness of a possible paradigm still requires awareness of how it can be achieved.

But carry on ;)

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Agreed, but there will always be a leader behind the top One(s) to emerge if the top One(s) are removed.  As least there will be until They have gone through a vast many.  And before that happens, I think We can wrest control.

And that could take Centuries...

I have only a relatively short time left... so I like many others on this planet first need to worry about the here and NOW and work to make my situation and the future of my family secure. Along the way I share the method of how others can do it...

Your TAP is a grand idea... for sometime in the future...  People in need care little about the distant future.  Give a man a fish and he will have a full stomach and will listen to your speech (they do this all the time at shelters)  but tomorrow that man will be more interested in looking for the next meal than thinking about the future

teach him to fish (fend for HIMSELF and his family) he will then feel more secure and have time to consider your plan

This is how politicians and both benevolent leaders and despots alike have always operated.  They identify the NEED THAT PEOPLE HAVE TODAY.... then provide that need and the people will follow them straight into hell.

Hitler did this... that is why he got as far as he did

Cult leaders do this, Religious leaders do this, Obama did this and got reelected

I did this and soon had a small Kingdom of loyal followers

People respond better to lofty ideas when they can see 'what's in it for me?'  If you can provide a solution for their IMMEDIATE woes... they will listen to your plans.


Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 12:17:01 pm
In a way, yes.  It shows Our willingness to do things for the social currency We receive:  thanks, praise, name recognition, and on and on.  (I'm pretty sure You didn't do it with nothing in social currency in return...)

Again, You are looking at a system where exchange is required to survive.  In TAP, there is no such requirement.

But that is a direct contradiction. Your 'social currency' IS still a system of exchange. Whether people do something for a paycheck or for the good feeling they get... they are still extracting a fee. I have paid workers with chocolate chip cookies and/or a pretty piece of paper they can frame...

Point is they CHOSE to do things for the accepted fee... but in the end it is still a barter system.

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What do You love to do - irrespective of cost?  You would not do those things?  Or do You truly have nothing You love to do?

This is a strawman argument. ANYONE can do what they want to do IF they apply all their energy to focus on that. The very Law of Attraction you are using to get to the tipping point works on your personal situation.

I have seen you say you have no money, cannot get a job... yet you are not disabled and have a computer and FREE TIME.  I have shown you many ways to take those resources you have and use them to change your personal situation.

Yet you continue to focus on all the negative things in life and not make the effort.  How many hours a day do you spend posting doom and gloom and anti gubment posts?  Use that time constructively instead of feeding the flame of the cabal.

An HOUR a day spent online creating online sales and in a few months you will have money that you can use to go on a campaign to push your plan if you choose
 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 12:50:37 pm
What was that Einstein quote about the fish and the tree?...

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
? Albert Einstein

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How can you teach people to find their 'gifts'?... If somebody has a gift they should damn well know about it.

True...  and you cannot teach that fish to climb that tree... so you need to tell that fish it is okay to be a fish :D

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In regards to training, I believe all the greats have trained them selves, just as everybody today should train them selves.

This is exactly how it works. GOLD for bringing that up... and I have THE perfect example here...

This person was poor... had no money to go to college... this person taught himself...

Abraham Lincoln

Reared in a poor family on the western frontier, Lincoln was self-educated, and became a country lawyer,

Yet he managed to put his dream into ACTION and abolished slavery. Lincoln knew the Secret... ;) 

"Always bear in mind that your own resolution to succeed is more important than any other." - Abraham Lincoln

A LOT can be learned from simple quotes from those who know the Secret...

But ONE THING they have in common... they stress that you have to help yourself, before you can help others

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'Money Management' for example - how hard is that?
Work out your income, work out your expenses, work out a survival budget etc etc.
I'm not trained in money managment, however, if it ever occured to me I needed training in money management, I'd train my self, if I couldn't hire a peer. 

It is actually easy, once you decide you need to know and learn the basics.  When I was growing up, no one taught this skill... but you could learn it by going to the library or ASKING someone to teach you.

If a poor man confronts a rich man and says affirmatively..."One day I will be as rich as you!!!"  what answer do you think the rich man will give?

"Hire a peer" is great... but you don't have to pay :D  Today we have the internet. This when used as a tool for self help is a powerful tool for "We the people" to change their life.  All the information you need is at your beck and call. NEVER in history have so many had access to so much information.

But what do most do with it?  Spread gloom and doom or waste their life 'liking' endless stupid pictures or tweeting endless stupid comments and sharing what they had for breakfast

When I was 10 years old, I became interested in collecting rocks. I went to the show near our cottage. Met an older Croatian chap who was very pleasant and eager to share his knowledge. He was a gem cutter. In the years that followed he taught me his skill. I never followed it as a career, but today I can still teach my daughter.

The point is he was HAPPY to share his knowledge for FREE with someone who was interested.  he moved to Australia, has now passed on... but I guess its time I turn that skill into bank :D

Last week my daughter got her first credit card...  She had saved 300.00 from selling video games on Ebay... games she gets at the pawn shop for $10.00 and sells for $20.00 to $30.00  It took a while because Ebay limits you in games at the start. Her time was up yesterday so now she can go full speed ahead.

That 300.00... we took to the bank and got a secured VISA card... took 5 minutes, not credit check.  Yesterday she used it at that pawnshop to buy a few more games... Well the pawn shop now dropped them to $5.00 each and the guy said since you come here often and buy a lot I can do better... $4.00 each... the other guy said we can do better... $3.00 each

So she has learned that there are ways to beat the system  simply by focusing on positive thoughts. She bought a couple used leather jackets at a yard sale $3.00 to $5.00 each  Sold 2 f them already one at $25.00, one at $50.00

Sure I repeat myself a lot :P  But hopefully others reading will take a hint :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 12:57:55 pm
I notice you are leaning more towards how 'people should rely on others' (Service to others)
I maintain that if everybody served them selves adequately, then no one needs to help anyone (service to self)

Ancient Illuminati Secret :P 

There are two more 'Secrets' that are being overlooked here but have been proven true by time... and they follow directly on your line of thought...

1) "You cannot help others without helping yourself first"

This one is self explanatory... and falls under the "practice what you preach" category

2) "You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich"

This one needs a little expansion ;) This one is often attributed to Lincoln but was really William J. H. Boetcker

An outspoken political conservative, Rev. Boetcker is perhaps best remembered for his authorship of a pamphlet entitled The Ten Cannots that emphasizes freedom and responsibility of the individual on himself.

You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot help little men by tearing down big men.
You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich.
You cannot establish sound security on borrowed money.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than you earn.
You cannot build character and courage by destroying men's initiative and independence.
And you cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they can and should do for themselves.


What Lincoln said was similar though..

Lincoln said "Let not him who is houseless pull down the house of another; but let him labor diligently and build one for himself, thus by example assuring that his own shall be safe from violence when built."

pretty much sums it up IMO ;)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 01:25:20 pm
That is the thing... this 'tipping point'  What exactly is that?  A few years back the webbots were all the rage... they spoke of a tipping point and made predictions that didn't happen.

Have you actually done research on how many people would need to be fully aware of TAP before it reaches this tipping point?

It is that point where enough People know that it seems, nearly overnight We all are talking about it.  It's the hula hoop phenomenon.  Few had heard of it but suddenly, when only a small fraction saw an ad, EVERYONE knew what it was.

Given that, the answer to the second part is about 10%.  And THAT depends on demographics:  10% of what segment.  10% of the People on twitter, for Twitter to be abuzz.  From there...the planet.

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Have you taken into account that on a percentage basis to make it global you would need numbers in the Muslin sector and the Chinese sector?  Since the later make up the majority of the worlds population... you cannot leave them out

Actually, not really...  10% of Humans at least speak English well enough to grasp, I bet.  It doesn't matter WHERE the 10% of Humans is located on the planet.  It Will tip and flow to all.

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I 100% believe in the Law of Attraction... but I also know this... it works on a one on one basis between you and the universe. This has been known throughout time... it is repeatedly stressed in "The Secret"... it is the source of the term "God helps those who help themselves"

Yeah, You bet.  And because I CARE so DAMN much about Humanity on this planet, it helps ME greatly to spend time spreading awareness.  Social currency account rising in balance.

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Okay you... Do you have any political experience? Where do you want to start? Local level?  Are you currently affiliates with any party or would you run as independent?

Political experience...?  Only a great amount of observation.  I'll start where I find supporters.  Have spread awareness to get Them.  I am a member of the Ethical Planetarian party.,

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The video was great... save for that mask. No one thinks the plan is stupid. There are many others pushing abundance out there. But if you were really wanting people to take you seriously, drop the silly mask... have the courage to make your case as a human... not a member of some faceless group that even you told us has no organiazation (thus no focus)  It may be fun to run with the other faceless sheep and way placards denouncing "da gubment"  but if you want to be remembered for the SOLUTION not the ANARCHY, drop the silly mask. Most people I know are getting pissed off at Anon. But certainly if you have a serious message... make a video with charts facts and concrete steps to show people HOW they can get to a position to shift paradigms.

*I* want to "be remembered" for anything.  If another takes My ideas and runs with them, I DON'T CARE.  The IDEAS are what count.  It wasn't "hiding."  Geez.  It was removing judgments based on bias relative to the specific presenter.  As much as I could with what I had to work with.

I chose that group also because revolutionaries are generally VASTLY more open-minded, and it doesn't matter WHO on twitter I touch - just how many.  I have lots of support there.


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As you say if they cannot see it they don't know it's there...

But as I say  if they cannot see HOW or WHAT they can do to make the shift... they will soon loose interest in the message and look for something else, and then the plank tips back the other way

What? "Spread the word.  Keep it in Consciousness."  That's not enough?  "Work on free energy extraction methods if You have the wherewithall."  Better?  And no...  The Ones who truly get it DON'T "lose interest."  How does One lose interest in a solution to the vast percentage of Human problems?

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Awareness of a possible paradigm still requires awareness of how it can be achieved.

Yeah.  I'm doing My best.  Giving that info out.

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But carry on ;)

I will.

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And that could take Centuries...

Yeah...  But with the interweb, I'm guessing We could achieve it in a decade or two if We truly put Our energy towards it.

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I have only a relatively short time left... so I like many others on this planet first need to worry about the here and NOW and work to make my situation and the future of my family secure. Along the way I share the method of how others can do it...

What more can One be asked of?  If solutions are being shared, that is what matters.

Quote
Your TAP is a grand idea... for sometime in the future...  People in need care little about the distant future.  Give a man a fish and he will have a full stomach and will listen to your speech (they do this all the time at shelters)  but tomorrow that man will be more interested in looking for the next meal than thinking about the future

With that approach, the NWO wins - whoever They are.  We don't know Their names but Their hand is clearly evident.  Maybe You are unaware of how IMPERATIVE things are on this planet?

And who's giving fishes?  Ideas are the food for the mind.

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teach him to fish (fend for HIMSELF and his family) he will then feel more secure and have time to consider your plan

That's just silly as an analogy.  And mostly impossible in places like inner cities.  Only "fending" is scraping by on any job One can manage to get and crime.  Feed Their MINDS with IDEAS, and then They will have them to feed Others.

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This is how politicians and both benevolent leaders and despots alike have always operated.  They identify the NEED THAT PEOPLE HAVE TODAY.... then provide that need and the people will follow them straight into hell.

Good thing TAP allows Each of Us to discover and define Our own needs with no One manipulating Us with gifts.

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Hitler did this... that is why he got as far as he did

Cult leaders do this, Religious leaders do this, Obama did this and got reelected

Obama was "elected" by preprogrammed machines...  Be that as it may, what has ANY of these got to do with TAP?

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I did this and soon had a small Kingdom of loyal followers

That pay taxes to You such that You have no other need of support...?  Again, You bring games into RL.  When They support You fully and in the style a king should, then bring this up.

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People respond better to lofty ideas when they can see 'what's in it for me?'  If you can provide a solution for their IMMEDIATE woes... they will listen to your plans.

And if I show a path from here to there, They listen, too, it turns out.  Not necessarily accept, but listen.  And really, that's all that matters.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 01:50:25 pm
Want the free energy devices to make it big time?

GIVE them to CHINA... free of charge

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 01:50:46 pm
What was that Einstein quote about the fish and the tree?...

How can you teach people to find their 'gifts'?... If somebody has a gift they should damn well know about it.

Yes and no.  As a child, if You are never exposed to music in any form, You are likely not to discover You can write beautiful music.  Just saying.  And that is the point of teaching children to FIND Their gifts:  to learn what's out there, to have the tools to TRY everything that They want to explore. 

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In regards to training, I believe all the greats have trained them selves, just as everybody today should train them selves.
'Money Management' for example - how hard is that?
Work out your income, work out your expenses, work out a survival budget etc etc.
I'm not trained in money managment, however, if it ever occured to me I needed training in money management, I'd train my self, if I couldn't hire a peer. 

Some are untrainable in some things.  I had the same idea about learning advanced math.  Got a bunch of textbooks, from high school rags to college tomes.  Even had the help of an engineer friend.  I discovered from THAT, I am mathematically challenged.

And I have known People who just could not handle a checkbook to save Their lives.

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I notice one of your replies to Zorg is 'inaction of the Good leads to the Evil rule'.
I used the same statement in counter to one of your aguments last week.

Wishy Washy  :P

Huh?  Ok...

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I notice you are leaning more towards how 'people should rely on others' (Service to others)
I maintain that if everybody served them selves adequatley, then no one needs to help anyone (service to self)

I agree with that, in principle.  So...  The eyeless are just on Their own?  The legless?  The dim of wit?  I doubt it.  There will always be People who CARE.  I don't push for ANY reliance one way or another.  I see TAP and working towards it as BOTH service to Self (freeing One to choose how to spend One's life) and Service to Others (Frees everyOne else to choose how THEY will spend Their lives).
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 01:54:07 pm
Ancient Illuminati Secret :P 

There are two more 'Secrets' that are being overlooked here but have been proven true by time... and they follow directly on your line of thought...

1) "You cannot help others without helping yourself first"

This one is self explanatory... and falls under the "practice what you preach" category

2) "You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich"

This one needs a little expansion ;) This one is often attributed to Lincoln but was really William J. H. Boetcker

An outspoken political conservative, Rev. Boetcker is perhaps best remembered for his authorship of a pamphlet entitled The Ten Cannots that emphasizes freedom and responsibility of the individual on himself.

You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot help little men by tearing down big men.
You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich.
You cannot establish sound security on borrowed money.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than you earn.
You cannot build character and courage by destroying men's initiative and independence.
And you cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they can and should do for themselves.


What Lincoln said was similar though..

Lincoln said "Let not him who is houseless pull down the house of another; but let him labor diligently and build one for himself, thus by example assuring that his own shall be safe from violence when built."

pretty much sums it up IMO ;)

Yup.  For One who saw only the scarcity paradigm, He was pretty astute.

(And You may note that TAP does not "tear down" the rich - just takes power over Others away.)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 05, 2013, 02:29:02 pm
Here is the "tipping point" from a scientific view.

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Scientists at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute have found that when just 10 percent of the population holds an unshakable belief, their belief will always be adopted by the majority of the society. The scientists, who are members of the Social Cognitive Networks Academic Research Center (SCNARC) at Rensselaer, used computational and analytical methods to discover the tipping point where a minority belief becomes the majority opinion.

The finding has implications for the study and influence of societal interactions ranging from the spread of innovations to the movement of political ideals. “When the number of committed opinion holders is below 10 percent, there is no visible progress in the spread of ideas. It would literally take the amount of time comparable to the age of the universe for this size group to reach the majority,” said SCNARC Director Boleslaw Szymanski, the Claire and Roland Schmitt Distinguished Professor at Rensselaer.

 “Once that number grows above 10 percent, the idea spreads like flame.” As an example, the ongoing events in Tunisia and Egypt appear to exhibit a similar process, according to Szymanski. “In those countries, dictators who were in power for decades were suddenly overthrown in just a few weeks.” -

http://news.rpi.edu/luwakkey/2902 

(http://www.rpi.edu/news/image/pr/2011-0725-scnarc_visual.gif)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 03:03:24 pm
In that model...

WHAT IF  there are say THREE IDEAS at the same time

idea #1 holds sway with 10% of the people..

idea #2 holds sway with 15% of the people

idea #3 holds sway with wit 30% of the people

In that case WHICH idea tips the balance?

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 05, 2013, 03:09:59 pm
In that model...

WHAT IF  there are say THREE IDEAS at the same time


Good question Z.

My guess is the idea that is the most viable, the most
likely to succeed by way of the road well paved would
be the ding ding ding ....winner?

Are there any previous examples we could draw from?

In the case of free energy, just my opinion but
it seems there are a few natural laws that have
not been hurtled yet....I posted something on this
a few weeks ago.

Maxwells Demon and all, but I am not an engineer,
so I only have ideas, and critical thinking.

Here is one more thing....the concept of
robots doing "everything" ...is this really
viable?

How many robots would one person need to do
all of the things they have to do that require my time?

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 03:24:50 pm
Quote
from: zorgon on Today at 03:03:24 PM
In that model...

WHAT IF  there are say THREE IDEAS at the same time

idea #1 holds sway with 10% of the people..

idea #2 holds sway with 15% of the people

idea #3 holds sway with wit 30% of the people

In that case WHICH idea tips the balance?

Which hit 10% first?

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Fruitbat on November 05, 2013, 03:59:50 pm
Guess who wrote this?  (answer at the bottom)

 Suppose that a hundred years hence we are eight times better off than today. The economic problem may be solved.

    The economic problem, the struggle for subsistence, always has been the primary, most pressing problem of the human race. Thus for the first time since his creation man will be faced with his real, his permanent problem – how to use his freedom from pressing economic cares, how to live wisely and agreeably and well.

    When the accumulation of wealth is no longer of high social importance, there will be great changes in the code of morals. The love of money will be recognized for what it is, a somewhat disgusting morbidity, one of those semi-criminal, semi-pathological propensities which one hands over with a shudder to the specialists in mental disease.

    I see us free, therefore, to return to some of the most sure and certain principles of religion and traditional virtue – that avarice is a vice, that the exaction of usury is a misdemeanor, and the love of money is detestable.

John Maynard Keynes...
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 04:10:04 pm
Which hit 10% first?

The 23% :D  Muslims with 100% total belief by the people supporting their paradigm so vehemently they are willing to die in support of it

23% of the world population is Muslim and growing fast

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 04:13:08 pm
In the meantime here is a case where it show what people become when they get 'abundance' and no longer have to work :P

The 23% :D  Muslims with 100% total belief by the people supporting their paradigm so vehemently they are willing to die in support of it.

Human nature at its finest :P

(http://i.imgur.com/lZbieYN.jpg)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 05, 2013, 04:46:56 pm
Guess who wrote this?  (answer at the bottom)

Nice speech :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 05:13:07 pm
Ya know...  Keynes clearly did not understand the role of a money system in promoting the psychopaths, or if He did, He hid it well.

And Y'know, out of tens of thousands of "rich" People, if You think being able to find one or three entertainment "stars" - who are COACHED to be outrageous for the cameras - paints the picture of how They all - or even most of Them - live, You've been sucking too much MSM teat.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 05, 2013, 06:24:43 pm
Quote
So...  I should just give up?  Let it go and scrape it out the rest of My days, learning that My ideas are pointless?  That what I do is irrelevant?

Is that what I can take from what You said?

NO you misunderstand me....   :)

Why give up your efforts they directly have an affect on yourself?

It is yourself which is important, and what you experience here. (In this Program)

Why do you believe your ideas are pointless ? Surely they are the most important to you ?

Your ideas are far from being irrelevant, as they directly affect you.

It is what you learn by the time the "story" is over for you in this generation, just as it will be for me
and others.

I thought Sky put it well for you ?


Look, I hopefully will learn as well, as a result of my independent efforts, and at the end of the day,
what I do or Don't do, will only affect myself and no one else.

When I die, I will be forgotten by the world within a few days, and it will be like I had never been
on Earth (In the Earth Program)

But hopefully I will have learnt something out of it all, and will make use of what I have experienced
(and hopefully learnt) in the future beyond this present experience.

I guess I am just the eternal optimist ?    :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 06:40:02 pm
NO you misunderstand me....   :)

Why give up your efforts they directly have an affect on yourself?

It is yourself which is important, and what you experience here. (In this Program)

Why do you believe your ideas are pointless ? Surely they are the most important to you ?

Your ideas are far from being irrelevant, as they directly affect you.

It is what you learn by the time the "story" is over for you in this generation, just as it will be for me
and others.

I thought Sky put it well for you ?


Look, I hopefully will learn as well, as a result of my independent efforts, and at the end of the day,
what I do or Don't do, will only affect myself and no one else.

When I die, I will be forgotten by the world within a few days, and it will be like I had never been
on Earth (In the Earth Program)

But hopefully I will have learnt something out of it all, and will make use of what I have experienced
(and hopefully learnt) in the future beyond this present experience.

I guess I am just the eternal optimist ?    :)

I did not say I thought it was pointless...  I was asking You if that was what You were saying...

I struggle with the idea that My work is all for ME when it is Humanity I do what I do for.  Not ME.  I mean, if I succeed, I will take advantage too, but for those children who die of starvation, for My daughter who will live in Agenda 21 if We do nothing, these are My motivations.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 05, 2013, 08:56:27 pm
Want the free energy devices to make it big time?

GIVE them to CHINA... free of charge

Hey does Deuem get the first one.  The line starts behind me fellas.
 
As I wrote some months ago, Free energy here would be met with a trip to the bottom of a river.
 
I have friends in high and low places. They all said, if not on the meter, don't do it. Even a tickle would get by but no plug no start up.....TPTB are everywhere and they don't want the boat to be rocked. Very efficent is the word, Even if that plug only lit up a LED on a 5 hp Air con, It is plugged in....step by step....
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 05, 2013, 09:05:35 pm
well i have tried to keep out of this  mostly because there are good points here and there

but
if you are waiting for the perfect time to be happy  or to be saved or for someone to listen to you
or anything
you are SO missing the point of this excusion on this rock

you have to find what is in yourself at this moment to be joyous..not just so-so content
but to be happy in the chaos..
 in someone elses words   ..    find your bliss
 maybe that bliss is just comfort..but it's your decision what your bliss is in the moment
and it can change
if you spend your time looking to others..you have failed
we are all  like a pebble into the pool.. your whatever  spreads
i'ld rather my spirals outward were joyous

Z is working on his by dumping the financial bs and along the way he is sharing his info
it's not on him wheather anyone uses it..he did his part
sadly amy  imo you are sitting on your hands waiting for someone to take care of you and what you think the world should be like.
.perhaps a better use for your dreams would be writting fantasy novels..you have excellent writting skills and some ideas that would be great stories..
flesh them out.. and get them published...pretent it is fiction
that seems to work well for coming true..
most here are living off of ideas they have seen in print or watched in movies..
you might accomplish your goals in that way
argueing your ideas here isn't doing it

by being here we are afforded the time to learn that we truly are in charge of our own destiny
tons of deversions and such to slow you down.. but only if you let yourself be sidetracked



there is only one lesson here...you are in charge of your own and only your own destiny


every obstical in your path is only to make you be more aware that
you call the shots in how things are handled for you

sorry for the mini rant and soapbox preachiness..
going outside to pull some weeds..

Somehow missed this in the barrage of posting.  Maybe You all fail to see the very deep ecstasy I feel in having ideas I know are worthwhile to offer Humanity.  Is it that unclear?

No, I am NOT "sitting on My hands."  I have ONE thing I live for and that is giving Humanity a plan that takes Us away from Agenda 21, Codex Alimentarius, GMO's, "geoengineering," sodium fluoride, Aspartame, HFCS, water grabs, air taxes...

But I know I am a burden because I am not finding work.  I have applied to over 75,000 jobs, EVERY ONE being certain I would be offered it - and here I am.

I wrote The Abundance Paradigm, a novella, as science "fiction."  Added some other pieces and made a book.  It is sitting on Amazon Kindle gathering dust, not having sold enough to yet get one royalty check.

I'm not good at selling, I guess.

If I could get printouts I could send it to all the places that require hard copy - the bigger houses.  I have sent it to a number of esubmission places, and am still awaiting to hear back from Analog.  The other places turned it down.

I can only write well what is in My heart; if another fiction comes along in My heart, I will write it, but for now I am busy writing things to best express what is in there now.  And that is how We can solve this mess.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 05, 2013, 10:14:27 pm
I have been reading this since the start and I think that all Peggy people understand what TAP is all about. It is not the idea I am in question about, it is the turn over of the entire planet that is in question. I think if 100% of the planet knew about this it would not trip. It is not like replacing a dictator or marching on wall street. It is a re-write of every single thing people do. A re-boot of life.
 
How do we do that with out some master detailed plan of events to follow.  I did find another post I made here on the wrong thread and I asked Z to move it, his and your answer also.
 
I talked about backwards planning and plans..Maybe just take one of those and plan it down to a "T" to see if it could be done. You see, just saying something never gets anything done. The elite are either born into it or they have a great plan to get it.  Without a detailed plan it is just winging it and people will drop you very fast. Just another 2012 thingy..
 
If they have something to sink their teeth into you will suceed.......Sheep need a tender. In this field I think most of us are sheep. Since this would be harder than going to the moon, the plan needs to be even better than what ever they had...
 
Peggy people are not your targets for awareness, they should be the targets for figuring out the details and giving you ideas for the plan, like we do in the IG. Your a member there, I hope you can see how it works and why we all love it. We work together.....a KEY !
 
I think if you present it like a flow chart and list the questions and ask for fixes you will get a better responces. People love to help. We will tap you with our knowledge of the world. Plant the idea and let it grow. If it is worthwhile, it will grow.  Don't ever under estimate the power of this group to come up with answers. Many will go out to their other sites and ask there for you. And do research for FREE to assist you. Ask away, you get fruit, State away, you get stoned.  Simple logic...
 
In all my few years of forums, I have never been stoned to death for asking a question. Stating a fact or opinion, YES...We all have been stoned from time to time. Ouch !
 
Think this way, you are in our future living in a perfect TAP life and you are telling me how your world overcame every problem to get there. Figure out what the problems are and ask how to fix them.
 
What is my world going to look like when you tell me my story  ;) ;)
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 05, 2013, 11:32:05 pm
Quote
I struggle with the idea that My work is all for ME when it is Humanity I do what I do for.  Not ME.  I mean, if I succeed, I will take advantage too, but for those children who die of starvation, for My daughter who will live in Agenda 21 if We do nothing, these are My motivations.

I once believed the same about what I am doing, but the "Program Books" are Not written
by the "Absolute Centre" of your, me or any other except our individual Outer Mind.

It is the function of the "Absolute Centre" of the Mind to experience, and it is the function
of your Other End of your mind (Outer) to present WHAT the "Outer End"
of your Mind (LIFE) has "Written", despite what many may want to believe.

A kart does NOT normally tow a horse, unless it is out of control.
Normally it is the horse which tows the kart.
 
When one receives the Processing Systems "Updates" and learns how to edit Programs,
we are sill restrained by Programed "boundaries" containing our options.


It is the "boundaries" which Controls the degree of our experience.


I can understand the need to change, but we must learn what this world is really about, 1st.

It has nothing at all to do with temporary things, but instead that which is permanent. (Eternal)


This Program (Earth and species) does have a unique purpose, which has nothing at all to do
with human imagination, beliefs, religion, or human evolution, or development, nor does it
have anything to do with bliss or suffering.


It is the "Outer Mind" which governs and looks after the "Absolute Centre" end of the Mind.   :)

The human primate can't as it wanders through the Maze.

But then sadly some think they know better than LIFE....


It does however involve a purpose, which never enters the human psyche of most.


When we discover these things our understanding of this world changes.


In some ancient writings this world was known as "The City of Endurance".   :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 06, 2013, 12:31:52 am

Maybe You all fail to see the very deep ecstasy I feel in having ideas I know are worthwhile to offer Humanity.  Is it that unclear?


Amy, imo it is very clear that you have a deep
belief in your TAP ideas, which is a key to any
concept taking off and taking hold.

Peggy has some bright minds, and some
of the kindest folks; a good sounding
board for your ideas...as such a place is
rare to find, maybe take a look at the
feedback, and try and choose one or two
ideas/concepts you deem as valid input.

As a small example, I think that your
TAP concept has potential, yet
you have very far forward thinking
( not a bad thing ) ....maybe try
and scale it to the next 50 years of
technology, then scale from there
to some everyday energy sources
that have a viable solution on the
horizon, and incorporate those
steps into a larger picture.

This is not a criticism, rather
trying to brainstorm your ideas
with the other minds here. At least
that is what I see happening.....


 
Quote
I have ONE thing I live for and that
is giving Humanity a plan that takes Us away
from Agenda 21, Codex Alimentarius, GMO's,
"geoengineering," sodium fluoride, Aspartame,
HFCS, water grabs, air taxes...

Again, imo that is a solid goal.

Quote
I wrote The Abundance Paradigm, a novella, as science "fiction." 

Amy, this is just an idea, again not a criticism. What if you took
your works as they are and elevated them to a "next" level
in either direction. For instance, take your science "fiction" and
embellish it to make your case more "powerful".

Imagine Orwell and his 1984, or Huxley and his
Brave New World....works of "fiction" that are
essentially playing out now as we live.

If you were to do this it in no way would diminish
the power of your TAP ideas when they might
take hold in the future, conversely it would
make them more powerful.

Adding to that our time here is
finite, and ultimate abundance
is not in this physical world,
which is what I think Z is saying....
money and freedom do not equate
out to abundance. As you well know
there is abundance apart from money,
as well as apart from an existing money
system. Abundance is not tied to
the physical world. We first must
overcome the physical limitations
finding abundance apart from,
and beyond the here and now.

And I know that you know this,
I am hinting that your
TAP concepts would benefit
from incorporating this
other wordly strength
into your basic plan.
I know your thinking that
yet I would suggest that
you go big with this part,
as it would enhance the
gap that exists between
the existing tech, and your ideas.

Other men have done it, and done it
well and made a success from
this, as some further examples

Quote
According to the philosophical point of view of Einstein, Dirac, Bell, Polyakov, ’t Hooft and few other theorists, there might be some non-material space filling medium enabling the observed physical processes, an Aether, occupying every point in space. As yet, there is no a corresponding theory.
 
So Albert Einstein in 1920:” We may say that according to the general theory of relativity space is endowed with physical qualities; in this sense, therefore, there exists an Aether. According to the general theory of relativity space without Aether is unthinkable; for in such space there not only would be no propagation of light, but also no possibility of existence for standards of space and time (measuring-rods and clocks), nor therefore any space-time intervals in the physical sense. But this Aether may not be thought of as endowed with the quality characteristic of ponderable media, as consisting of parts which may be tracked through time. The idea of motion may not be applied to it.” [11]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aether_theories

Again, this is just a thought, taking into account
the input of the others here in which we are
all on "your" side, collaborating with you.  :)

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 06, 2013, 02:25:19 am
As a member of ig.i would say it would be a privelege but im smart enough to realize that tap would be harder to create than trying to manage china.it is such a colossus.then to add a timeline of change to  tap.100yrs maybe.for full effect.
I personally like the jules verne idea.i think thats the path that amy should take.plus it would give her time to think out the details more thoroughly .the problem is she may publish a wonderful book but her theory will not see fruit until way after she has passed away.probly make a great read though.

As devils advocate.how many silverspoon trust fund babies do you see being productive citizens in the world.i dont see any.and they are basically living tap.i know one that is a evil mason pervert and another  that is a total fruitcake methhead that let her outside dogs sleep in the same bead as her new born baby.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: sky otter on November 06, 2013, 08:10:33 am

dang just lost a whole bunch of type..grrrrrrrr i hate when that happens



Somehow missed this in the barrage of posting.  Maybe You all fail to see the very deep ecstasy I feel in having ideas I know are worthwhile to offer Humanity.  Is it that unclear?

Amy
no that is not unclear..
your passion for your idea stands out like a lighthouse in the storm

and i used terminology that was hurtful..sorry

i do agree with bts
that the back and forth on this forum is not mean but trying to show you how it is taken by others..
and that should be helpful to modifying your approach ..imo

perhaps you should be looking for an agent to do the selling..
i wish i could be more helpful but i have become more hermit like and can only dig up a few places i think that would be interested in your book

you might try these two as they are progressive in their approach to life

http://www.llewellyn.com/

http://www.hayhouse.com/

also if you check out the bio of louise hay you may be able to pick up some pointers on getting your book to the masses..it's an amazing story of a woman from rags to riches by her own talents


good luck
 ;D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 09:20:44 am
I have been reading this since the start and I think that all Peggy people understand what TAP is all about. It is not the idea I am in question about, it is the turn over of the entire planet that is in question. I think if 100% of the planet knew about this it would not trip. It is not like replacing a dictator or marching on wall street. It is a re-write of every single thing people do. A re-boot of life.

Yes, it is unique.  And that is because it relies on technology that We only NOW in Our history have.  Never before have We had the free energy access, robotics, and the interweb.

And I bet it WOULD trip.  And I will tell You WHY.  Statistically ALL of Us live in poverty, and so, statistically it will help ALL of Us.  If You have a Human who is starving to death who also knows of this approach, I can guarantee They will be for it.  It will mean They will not starve.
 
Quote
How do we do that with out some master detailed plan of events to follow.  I did find another post I made here on the wrong thread and I asked Z to move it, his and your answer also.

Because society is a stigmergy.  The whole idea is to point the direction and show the steps that We can take to get there.  What We do with it from there is where the glory and wonder will emerge from.

And what needs planning (beyond the steps I define)?  Can You give Me a specific?
 
Quote
I talked about backwards planning and plans..Maybe just take one of those and plan it down to a "T" to see if it could be done. You see, just saying something never gets anything done. The elite are either born into it or they have a great plan to get it.  Without a detailed plan it is just winging it and people will drop you very fast. Just another 2012 thingy..

Just saying something does not get it done, BUT...  If everyOne knows the goals and most approve (and most who understand will), Those that CAN do something will.  Other things will happen as a matter of course:  add free energy and fill all necessary jobs no One wants to do with robots, and the need for money will dissipate, vanishing when it gets to the point that the accounting efforts are more than the accounted for is "worth."  When it becomes like accounting for grains of sand:  pointless.

Quote
If they have something to sink their teeth into you will suceed.......Sheep need a tender. In this field I think most of us are sheep. Since this would be harder than going to the moon, the plan needs to be even better than what ever they had...

Hahaha.  It is DIFFERENT entirely.  There is no specific technical elements needed (just general robots and free energy, the specifics of which are up to Those examining the need and devising the extraction methods).
 
Quote
Peggy people are not your targets for awareness, they should be the targets for figuring out the details and giving you ideas for the plan, like we do in the IG. Your a member there, I hope you can see how it works and why we all love it. We work together.....a KEY !

Do remember I offer information through twitter with links here.  It's not JUST Peggy I write for.  And I tell You what, if You can offer a problem that You see that needs a "deeper plan," describe it to Me.  I cannot see anything We need to CONTROL.  That, in fact, is the whole point:  letting go of control.
 
Quote
I think if you present it like a flow chart and list the questions and ask for fixes you will get a better responces. People love to help. We will tap you with our knowledge of the world. Plant the idea and let it grow. If it is worthwhile, it will grow.  Don't ever under estimate the power of this group to come up with answers. Many will go out to their other sites and ask there for you. And do research for FREE to assist you. Ask away, you get fruit, State away, you get stoned.  Simple logic...

Well, I have a flowchart, but it's astoundingly simple.  In fact, I suspect the simplicity is what freaks People out.  They are so used to things being complex.  In truth, the complexity was added on purpose to keep Us from seeing how simple it all really is.

Maybe that's why You think more needs to be added...  Make it more difficult and confusing than it needs to be.

(http://rs1156.pbsrc.com/albums/p572/AmaterasuSolar/TAPFlowchart.png~320x480?t=1383754195)
 
Quote
In all my few years of forums, I have never been stoned to death for asking a question. Stating a fact or opinion, YES...We all have been stoned from time to time. Ouch !
 
Think this way, you are in our future living in a perfect TAP life and you are telling me how your world overcame every problem to get there. Figure out what the problems are and ask how to fix them.

I did that in The Abundance Paradigm...
 
Quote
What is my world going to look like when you tell me my story  ;) ;)
 
Deuem

Read The Abundance Paradigm:  http://files.abovetopsecret.com/files/aad67f70b7b43ddc.pdf
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Somamech on November 06, 2013, 11:15:48 am
Amy I do like your Idea's!

I think a very good example of the monetary system would be Housing Bubble's.  Oddly Australian's are in one and cannot see the rose through the thorns. 

As you know socitey put's way too much value on housing compared to investing in ideas which create housing.

Here in Ozzie Land the Banks have locked up a generation of wealth generation that could otherwise go into other project's.

Whoever started Kickstarter and crowdfunding had a great idea.  I do find these day's that it's being abused to some extent but the essence of people investing in other people's ideas to be a foot placed in the right direction.   :)

Although The Sea Shepherd may not be everyones cup of tea this video about changing the world is woprth watching no matter what one believes in.  It's stated in this video that you only need a small percentage of people to make a change ;)
[youtube]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0qOLGXZSqE[/youtube]





Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 06, 2013, 12:50:20 pm
In a nut shell....

You say "Make people aware"

Well everyone at Pegasus IS aware of your program and ideas. Most agree that in principal they are good ideas for the future.

So your mission is accomplished :P

No amount of repeating it will change anyone's mind. The questions being asked are all about the method of implementation... and you yourself admit you cannot answer that... that it will "just happen"

The issues I see...

ROBOTS

Many of us are not to keen on letting robots do that much for us... many believe that being human REQUIRES we work hard to gain personal advancement. You do not accept that there is more to life beyond this plane... so you make your case based on that belief.

I for one KNOW there is life beyond this one so I govern my life and actions accordingly. For this reason we will not see eye to eye on this plan in all details

You can be against religion all you wish, but if you don't take human nature into account, you will not prevail. Religion is control mechanism but a personal spiritual belief based on personal experience is NOT  You cannot fight that nor change that. The Communists tried and failed too.

Too many great minds have deal with the Robot scenario and how easily and quickly THEY become the new masters... and this is in the back of people's mind.  Yes the BOTS ARE COMING... that is already written in stone...  question is will we be their slaves (even if that slavery is simply sloth and apathy)

FREE ENERGY

Your whole thesis rides on this... abundant FREE ENERGY

You and many others claim 'da gubment' is with holding such technology...  maybe... maybe not.

Personally beyond solar power I don't believe THEY have it.  Despite all the inventors out there making claims, despite all the inventors at Pegasus working on a solution...  in my opinion NO ONE has yet broken through

If they had, the Military would be using these power sources.  But they are not. All their money is going into making solar collectors, laser power transmission and plasma sources.

When the atomic energy came out... before "we the people" even heard about it... they were building bombs with it and wasted no time using a few.

MIT is just now re discovering wireless power transmission (other than via lasers which the Navy already has strong enough to beam power to a moon base)

"Da gubment" suppressing it? Then why has John Searl not been assassinated yet? There are HUNDREDS of researches all around the world working on it... they are all alive...  but not one of them has a device that can be proven to work and be replicated.

"Da gubment" is not that efficient... they can't even manage the current budget and health care. NASA is a Comedy Circus. The NAVY is testing tons of new weapons and power sources... but all plasma related. The big labs Sandia, Los Alamos, LLNL, NRL ARL... ALL working on plasma and nuclear fusion

With the internet global system... if there WAS a true working device that would fall under "Free energy" it would be virtually impossible to stop it going viral

So until such a device IS created... we are stuck in THIS paradigm and most of us will have to make do best we can.

But we already HAVE the AWARENESS your selling  :D




Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 02:10:15 pm
Can't be more correct, than what you have said here Z regarding
Quote
"Da gubment"


And yes Death is nothing more than a Human Myth !

It is Impossible for our "Real Self" to Die, even IF we wanted to....   :)

It is only the human primate which desires Death...   :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 04:15:03 pm
I will ask the Robot question since it is a fear and not a blessing. Those who know will tell you over and over that if we take that step and create walkable human type robots, then at some time in the future they will become self aware and it is all over for us. I don't know one could stop it.
 
Engineers like to tinker and make things better. Scientist are now clonning everthing they can get their hands on. How long before A finds B and they clone brains for robots. The brain is still the best computer on the planet but they are catching up.
 
OK what is your version on this and what does Earth need to do to get there. Go 1st person.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 06, 2013, 04:59:10 pm
How long before A finds B and they clone brains for robots. The brain is still the best computer on the planet but they are catching up.

Sooner than you think, my friend...  and right in my backyard  :o

Pentagon’s DARPA preparing to equip robots with ‘real’ brains

(http://rt.com/files/news/1e/b5/50/00/rtr18zqx.si.jpg)
A robotics fan wears a button on his hat at the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) Grand Challenge in Primm Nevada. (Reuters / Gene Blevins)

Quote
Is the Pentagon trying to freaks us all out, or do they just want to give zombies something to eat? The Department of Defense is reportedly almost finished building robots with “real” brains.

That’s according to National Defense Magazine, which this week profiled the Pentagon’s Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) lab and a little known project that has sucked down millions of dollars during the last few years: millions of dollars spent trying to replicate the human brain.

National Defense Magazine’s Sandra Erwin explores the “physical intelligence” program this week, a research and development initiative launched back in 2009 in order to “to understand intelligence as a physical phenomenon and to make the first demonstration of the principle in electronic and chemical systems,” according to the Defense Department’s original solicitation.

Erwin says that four years later, a team of scientists led by University of California, Los Angeles Chemistry Professor James K. Gimzewski is just “inches away from the finish line” in terms of reaching their goal.

Gimzewski and crew have constructed a tiny machine, Erwin writes, that allows robots to attack independently. How independently? It won’t rely on convention computer code used to program cyborgs and robots like the kind found in Hollywood sci-fi flicks, but instead use microscopic wires to emulate the electrical and chemical pulses sent from cell to cell within the human brain.

“Rather than move information from memory to processor, like conventional computers, this device processes information in a totally new way,” says the scientist

Erwin continues:

“What sets this new device apart from any others is that it has nano-scale interconnected wires that perform billions of connections like a human brain, and is capable of remembering information, Gimzewski said. Each connection is a synthetic synapse. A synapse is what allows a neuron to pass an electric or chemical signal to another cell. Because its structure is so complex, most artificial intelligence projects so far have been unable to replicate it.”

According to DARPA, “The objective of the implementation domain is to demonstrate the first human-engineered open thermodynamic systems that spontaneously evolve nontrivial ‘intelligent’ behavior under thermodynamic pressure from their environment.”

“The objective of the analysis domain is to develop analytical tools to support the development of human-engineered physically intelligent systems and to understand physical intelligence in the natural world,” the agency writes.

On the website for UCLA’s Mechanical and Aerospace Engineering department, the goal of the “physical intelligence program” is described a bit more succinctly. “The project will not only lead to fundamental understanding about various physical and biological self-organization systems and origin of intelligence, but also practical applications such as the creation of next generation of electronic circuits with intelligent behaviors, and dynamic interactions/control of  biological systems,” says UCLA’s Yong Chen.

Dr. Gimzewski tells National Defense Magazine that a team of scientists have made great strides in the multi-million dollar project, even if it’s the most ambitious one he’s seen yet. But what happens when it’s finally complete?

“It is not clear, however, that the Pentagon is ready to adopt this technology for weapon systems,” writes Erwin, citing a Defense Department policy statement from last year that limits the Pentagon’s power to make autonomous robots.

Meanwhile, though, other DARPA operations like the PETMAN project reported by RT earlier this week suggest it’s only a matter of time before the military has some form or another of weaponized robot warriors.


http://rt.com/usa/systems-intelligence-robots-defense-781/
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: sky otter on November 06, 2013, 05:03:19 pm


Peggy people are not your targets for awareness


Well everyone at Pegasus IS aware of your program and ideas. Most agree that in principal they are good ideas for the future.

So your mission is accomplished

No amount of repeating it will change anyone's mind


well i disagree with this
Most agree that in principal they are good ideas for the future.


amy's vision of the  future is not my vision ..no where near what i want to see
and definitely not with robots of anykind..we are probably polar opposites in what we  want for the future



No amount of repeating it will change anyone's mind
except maybe to tune it out

i'm trying real hard not to be negetive or nasty..
and i am all for her doing what she can to make her dream come true.

i feel that way about all here..i support everyone who is working on whatever your dreams are
but
 this particular subject has gotten to where i think we are at saturation point. and only circling over and over..no progress is being made
but then maybe that is what forums are all about.. ::)

Amy i hope you can find someone to sell your program in book form..you deserve to be heard
and we have heard you..

good luck
 ;D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 05:14:43 pm
In a nut shell....

You say "Make people aware"

Well everyone at Pegasus IS aware of your program and ideas. Most agree that in principal they are good ideas for the future.

So your mission is accomplished :P


I guess...  Does that mean I should stop posting My work here and direct Twits to other sites...?

Quote
No amount of repeating it will change anyone's mind. The questions being asked are all about the method of implementation... and you yourself admit you cannot answer that... that it will "just happen"

Not exactly.  The People with the heart and skills WILL emerge.  I rely on the natural stigmergy inherent in all social creatures.  I don't have the expertise, but I can point the path easily enough.

Quote
The issues I see...

ROBOTS

Many of us are not to keen on letting robots do that much for us... many believe that being human REQUIRES we work hard to gain personal advancement. You do not accept that there is more to life beyond this plane... so you make your case based on that belief.

And for those of You that believe You should live a given way...knock Yourself out.  If You would rather scrub the commode than have a robot do it - don't ask for a robot to do it.  Don't ask for any robots if You don't WANT them.  But don't think You therefore have the right to tell the One who WANTS them, They can't HAVE them.

And really, it is not in housekeeping and all where robots are important.  Little illustration:

There is a planet with 100 People on it.  It's a very small planet, but could support 1000.  The fields need 25 People (just grabbing a number) to work them.  14 People LOVE to farm.  They step right up.

They still need 11 more.  They have a choice.  Force, coerce, or bribe 11 People to work the fields - OR add 11 robots, freeing the 11 to do what They WANT to do.

No One is FORCING robots on anyOne, but that they are used where necessary work needs to be done and too few WANT to do it.

You can go live in that yert on the Mongolian steppes I keep bringing up, or in a cave, no robots to be seen.

Quote
I for one KNOW there is life beyond this one so I govern my life and actions accordingly. For this reason we will not see eye to eye on this plan in all details

You can be against religion all you wish, but if you don't take human nature into account, you will not prevail. Religion is control mechanism but a personal spiritual belief based on personal experience is NOT  You cannot fight that nor change that. The Communists tried and failed too.

Whoa!  Who put ANY religious spin in here?  I am not "against religion!"  I have My own view, and that's that, but I would NEVER push ANYONE around on THEIR spiritual path.  In TAP, communities of worshipers will likely spring up.  One can follow ANY path One CHOOSES and as long as One does not break the three Laws, who cares?

Quote
Too many great minds have deal with the Robot scenario and how easily and quickly THEY become the new masters... and this is in the back of people's mind.  Yes the BOTS ARE COMING... that is already written in stone...  question is will we be their slaves (even if that slavery is simply sloth and apathy)

In TAP, with open source and all, I think We can avoid issues of "robots taking over."  And in TAP, if YOU want to be slothful and apathetic, no skin off anyOne's noses, and none of Their damned business either.

Quote
FREE ENERGY

Your whole thesis rides on this... abundant FREE ENERGY

You and many others claim 'da gubment' is with holding such technology...  maybe... maybe not.

No "maybe" about it in My experience.  Whether You choose to believe or not...  Meh.  Nothing I can do about it.

Quote
Personally beyond solar power I don't believe THEY have it.  Despite all the inventors out there making claims, despite all the inventors at Pegasus working on a solution...  in my opinion NO ONE has yet broken through

Oh, I assure You, SOMEONE has it.  But again, that is from personal experience.  Believe, don't.  Whatever.

Quote
If they had, the Military would be using these power sources.  But they are not. All their money is going into making solar collectors, laser power transmission and plasma sources.

And You don't think They might be:

1.  Keeping use localized where They know They won't have to explain it
2.  Putting in such places (on Our dime) to enrich contractors and hide the actual mainstay of power production

Could be.  I put nothing past Them.

Quote
"Da gubment" is not that efficient... they can't even manage the current budget and health care. NASA is a Comedy Circus. The NAVY is testing tons of new weapons and power sources... but all plasma related. The big labs Sandia, Los Alamos, LLNL, NRL ARL... ALL working on plasma and nuclear fusion

Frankly, such bumbling would look very much like They didn't know what They were doing and therefore not suspect.  Meanwhile, the real task at hand, breaking Humanity and establishing a psychopath-run New World Order, goes on.  They really don't care if We struggle, in Our part of Their puppet show.

Quote
With the internet global system... if there WAS a true working device that would fall under "Free energy" it would be virtually impossible to stop it going viral

So...  You're saying the tech in the deepest of the depths of black projects is surely out on the web by now?  Am I catching Your drift?

Quote
So until such a device IS created... we are stuck in THIS paradigm and most of us will have to make do best we can.

I will bet enough toadies will come forth if the ideas reach Them.  Us sharp monkeys I think I can rely on...too. 

Quote
But we already HAVE the AWARENESS your selling  :D

Everybody who is reading?  I'll take Your word for it.  [smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 05:37:58 pm
Quote
You can go live in that yert on the Mongolian steppes I keep bringing up, or in a cave, no robots to be seen.


See Amy, that is problem 1 to solve.  If she hates robots then she has to move? Why does she have to move to Mongolia?  This sounds like the smoking in public problem.
 
I like Robotics, I may not like robots. As long as there are companies, the PTB will use those robots and fire the humans. Hey they do that now with robotics. It is why I stopped designing them and went to a human needed assisted production method. No humans, no production. Yea it can clean my toilet but don't sit at my desk.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 05:39:44 pm
Amy i hope you can find someone to sell your program in book form..you deserve to be heard
and we have heard you..

good luck
 ;D

Oh.  Am I being dismissed, then?  Meh.

All of You behave as if "the regulars" here are the ONLY People involved.  You clamor for readership and then suppose We should not also have Them in mind as We type.

Frankly, I ALWAYS consider that a new mind might be touched.  But if skipping My posts is beyond the tolerance level of folks here, I can move My primary residence.

I suppose if this were said outside My li'l patch of ground here, I might choose more humble position at this point.  But here I am, in My section, and You come out rather swinging.

Sky, I want YOU to live in the manner YOU want to.  On Your pretty property with Your family of spirits about You.  Without worrying whether the tax collector or martial law tank will take it from You.

BUT...  I do NOT want to deprive ANYONE of THEIR blessed state, either.  To say, "No robots," automatically DENIES them of all Others.  You can make the rules on Your home domain.  If it be "no robots," so be it.  Join a community with the same values, even.

I mean...  Having the OPTION is what freedom is all about.

And as long as We persist with things as they are now, We will have to force, coerce or bribe People to do things They don't WANT to do.  Adding robots to take up slack in necessary work removes that necessity.  AND pulls the money(/power) rug out from under the psychopaths trying to march Us into Their uberrepressive New World Order.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 05:53:36 pm
Quote
I guess...  Does that mean I should stop posting My work here and direct Twits to other sites...?


No, Twitter has new people all the time and millions of readers, We have a very constant 500 membership and a few dozen constant readers/posters.
 
If your not careful on the amount of overload you present to the same few dozen people they will shut down or turn off and the tread dies with a lot of dis-like.
 
This site is the place to figure it out, not spread it out. If the brain power on this site can't figure it out then how are the average sheep going to do it. I think we are all very well informed on the idea and you need to now explore the HOWs.
 
If every twit came here to find out what to do instead of hearing the same spread news, your idea should spread faster and we get more members. In other words finding the same old same old after shifting sites gets old fast and I just click that little close box and move on for new ideas.
 
Maybe present the "next step" daily. And have a next step, not the same one from yesterday. To trip the entire world is like starting it all over again. Not easy.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: sky otter on November 06, 2013, 06:07:07 pm
dimissed..hardly

a differing point of view..yep..see that's where i am having a problem
you want respect for your ideas and wishes but  you tell others with different ideas to go live in a cave and not have robots..
but to let you have yours
the problem is we can't have it two ways unless someone
gives each fraction a contenent to themselves..
and then they still won't live in peace letting the other be other
with their piece..

that is the point Z it trying to make..humans are humans
and while you may be able to live in peace
others are not

unless the robots take the place of what you are calling
psychopaths... and we work for them under their rules..
it ain't gonna change much

and you telling me to go live on my property is redundant..i am
i have spend my life finding a way to work the system to MY benefit
and still stay under the radar

i had my own business and sold it to buy a horse and do competition
i made the choice to do that...
then i made the choice to go back to work at 40 and got into research..and when i got fed up i walked...
now did i have tons of luxury along the way..no.. but i found a way to enjoy every moment within the system

do i enjoy paying taxes.. no..but i can see where the money is going on this bottom level
to roads and infrastruction..that is currently in need of repair..cause folks 50 - 70 years ago made it work

i 'm sorry but into my brain has come a roger miller song just  as i type

maybe you have heard it

he sings
you can't roller skate in a buffalo herd.. but you can be happy if you have a mind too
bwhahahahahaha

sorry ..wierd sense of humor just kicks in at the oddest times

no i do not live in the lap of plenty.. but i have enough
and if i go for less.. i will still have enough
because that is my choice
and i have abundance of joy in counting what i have


i am sorry that your life sucks and you haven't realized your dream
i am sorry for a lot of folks who no matter what don't see the blessings of where they are
because if you look at your life  - you are where you are by your choices along the way

i  don't want to fight with you or put you down but i feel you are missing the point others are trying to make..

but i still wish you the best

and for the record.. i ddin't realize that we had places here and that this one was yours
i picked up the topic on the side bar and just jumped in..
opps, i guess  ;)



here ya go.. had to go find it


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YflASNDUsIU

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YflASNDUsIU[/youtube]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 06:13:38 pm

See Amy, that is problem 1 to solve.  If she hates robots then she has to move? Why does she have to move to Mongolia?  This sounds like the smoking in public problem.

No, no, no.  SHE can ordain in Her living land (that land She lives on) ANYthing She wants.  She just cannot deny anOther something as long as the Laws are kept.
 
Quote
I like Robotics, I may not like robots. As long as there are companies, the PTB will use those robots and fire the humans. Hey they do that now with robotics. It is why I stopped designing them and went to a human needed assisted production method. No humans, no production. Yea it can clean my toilet but don't sit at my desk.
 
Deuem

And THAT's My point.  NO ROBOTS would deny You something that does not break the Laws.

Failed to read through that first time around. Mea culpa.  The "sitting at Your desk" won't happen unless You don't WANT to do what You are doing at Your desk, and would rather study something, go sailing, do a sculpture, write a play, or whatever.  Your basic needs are met richly and the tools are available if You WANT to.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 07:03:05 pm
dimissed..hardly

a differing point of view..yep..see that's where i am having a problem
you want respect for your ideas and wishes but  you tell others with different ideas to go live in a cave and not have robots..

No.............  I said They CAN, if that is what PLEASES them.  I also have said You can have exactly what You have now without the worries of the NWO (taxes, tanks) - and likely a LOT more.  In terms of well-built tools, foods You would like to add to Your diet but either they are not available or You can't now afford them, artwork that the artists will gladly accept Your delight in Their work as payment...

Quote
but to let you have yours

Again, yeah. Both.  You have Your style and I'll have Mine. 

Quote
the problem is we can't have it two ways unless someone
gives each fraction a contenent to themselves..
and then they still won't live in peace letting the other be other
with their piece..

Why not have it two ways?  Why can't You who wants no robots just not have them?  Where's the problem?

Quote
that is the point Z it trying to make..humans are humans
and while you may be able to live in peace
others are not

All wars are incited, motivated by money, all news is fake, motivated by money, I see 99.9999999% of Humans NOT berserking daily but instead trying to get by with Those around Them as best They can.  Most can be bought at some level and then all evil is rooted, and We end up with what We have now.

And You think We will squabble when Our needs and many desires are met richly?  Really?

Quote
unless the robots take the place of what you are calling
psychopaths... and we work for them under their rules..
it ain't gonna change much

We ALL of Us work for Ourselves, Our families, Our friends, Our planet.  In whatever way creates bliss and does not break the Laws.  Freedom to find out just how good We really are, not having to fit in like replacing a cog.

Quote
and you telling me to go live on my property is redundant..i am
i have spend my life finding a way to work the system to MY benefit
and still stay under the radar

I did NOT tell You to go live on Your property.  I said THAT IS WHAT I WANT FOR YOU TO CONTINUE WITH.  I would take NOTHING from anyOne except power over Others.

Quote
i had my own business and sold it to buy a horse and do competition
i made the choice to do that...
then i made the choice to go back to work at 40 and got into research..and when i got fed up i walked...
now did i have tons of luxury along the way..no.. but i found a way to enjoy every moment within the system

All cool.  But tell Me, that child curled up dying of starvation with the buzzards patiently standing by awaiting death...  Think They are finding ways to enjoy that?

THAT is what I would end.

Quote
do i enjoy paying taxes.. no..but i can see where the money is going on this bottom level
to roads and infrastruction..that is currently in need of repair..cause folks 50 - 70 years ago made it work

And You don't think if the money problem were removed those roads wouldn't be kept to highest standards at all times?  Some People love to administrate and without money, it will happen when it needs to.

Quote
i 'm sorry but into my brain has come a roger miller song just  as i type

maybe you have heard it

he sings
you can't roller skate in a buffalo herd.. but you can be happy if you have a mind too
bwhahahahahaha

sorry ..wierd sense of humor just kicks in at the oddest times

Not a problem.  My dad and I used to sing that together.  He was a big RM fan, and I too appreciate His work.

Quote
no i do not live in the lap of plenty.. but i have enough
and if i go for less.. i will still have enough
because that is my choice
and i have abundance of joy in counting what i have

If it's ME Y'all think isn't HAPPY, You have it all wrong.  I am having a BLAST!  But I will not rest until there are no children starving with or without the buzzards' attention.  To say to that, "I'm happy, so it does not matter on this planet..." I cannot fathom.

Quote
i am sorry that your life sucks and you haven't realized your dream

Yeah.  You presume much.  My life does not suck in any way. It is as is was to be.  Like I said, I'm having a blast.

Quote
i am sorry for a lot of folks who no matter what don't see the blessings of where they are

I am acutely aware of My blessings, and love Those who have chosen to bless Me.  I am also acutely aware of a few things:

1.  The NWO is nearly where They will succeed - time is crucial to have a direction to go.
2.  Buzzard-beset children DO NOT HAVE TO BE on this planet, but because We distribute good stuff by profit and bad stuff by profit, We overproduce food by about 25% and then throw out close to HALF.

So please excuse Me if My passion runs high on solving for money - or really, for having to input Human energy to survive.

Quote
because if you look at your life  - you are where you are by your choices along the way

You think I don't take full responsibility for who I am, where I am, and what I am?  Again, presuming much.  I don't blame anyOne. Geez.

Quote
i  don't want to fight with you or put you down but i feel you are missing the point others are trying to make..

It's mutual.

Quote
but i still wish you the best

It's mutual!

Quote
and for the record.. i ddin't realize that we had places here and that this one was yours
i picked up the topic on the side bar and just jumped in..
opps, i guess  ;)

Fair enough, sky.  [smile]  I can see it happening.  Humble apologies for not seeing that perspective.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 07:35:44 pm
Quote
Failed to read through that first time around. Mea culpa.  The "sitting at Your desk" won't happen unless You don't WANT to do what You are doing at Your desk.  snip

I work for myself so yea but if worked for a company and the owners wishes were to have a robot work force, I would be wheeled out by a robot. Why would they need me, just to drink the coffee?
 
I think owners would replace workers as fast as they could. Hey no complaints, no medical insurance, no overtime, no vaction time, can work 24/7 and so on regardless if they are paying you.  I saw this happening and I stopped. Changed over to people related automation.
 
There are companies that are doing this now. Canon is one. They call it a black factory. Meaning no lights. All robotic. No people working there except a few syupid people who sweep the floor and oil the machines. The company used to hire real people that wanted to work there. I think that was the 50mm lens factory. So if I wanted to learn optics and make them I am out of luck to work there even if it is for free.
 
I am in a lot of construction/design here from time to time. If we had robots build all of our ghost cities then what do all the workers do. Oil them? If the construction company is robotic then it needs no workers. The diversity of different jobs will slowly come to a halt and then there will be nothing to do except paint a picture or pull weeds. What that really means to a lot of us is that the machines are running the world and I am secondary extra flesh decomposing thinking of what to do next.
 
Deuem needs a reason to live. i am already fat enough. ::)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 08:03:48 pm
Something to think about, talking about Robots !

The human Primate is a "Biological Machine" controlled or driven by LIFE. (or a "Partition" of LIFE)

So what is more Important The "Biological Machine" (or Biological Robot, whether we want to accept it or not)
or is The LIFE which drives it more Important  ?

LIFE, being your "Real Self" and NOT the body or Environment experienced by the Real Self...

As you should know there is far more to LIFE, than the experience, i.e. the "Biological Robot" referred to as
the "human Species" or any other species in this little Universe.

The Flesh can't Love as the flesh doesn't even know it exists let alone your "REAL SELF",
i.e. LIFE or AWARENESS or Consciousness.

Your Body doesn't know you or anything else it is ONLY your Awareness which is AWARE
that is why it is called "Awareness" and NOT a Species or anything else !

So all that is happening is Some are trying to copy or mimic the human Primate.

But there is far more to it than simply a human or other Species.

The only part of a Human primate that can be replicated is ONLY Part of the "Biological Machine".
as for the other 80 % to 90 % of the Brain's functions, Science is so far from understanding it,
they may as well never considered he human brain in the 1st place... LOL.

So time for us all to Learn I guess.

Hell even RNA hasn't been mapped Yet and it will take more than 10,000 years to do it IF one can !

RNA was once considered as Junk but that was ONLY because it could NOT be understood
back then and still can't.

The "ROOT" of the challenge, is NOT in producing more Human Ideas we have been doing just that
for Thousands and Thousands of Years and we have got nowhere at all.

Time to lean about our "REAL SELVES" instead of the biological machine we experience.

Most on Earth are at WAR against LIFE so until we make peace with LIFE
we are just going to create our own pain and suffering again...

IF we put LIFE 1st then our difficulties will fade away into history !

So let's do something practical and get to know our "Real Selves" 1st !

Hell most don't even know their other End even exists !   :)

This is why most are at WAR with LIFE !

That is why you have Weapons in your world!

After All LIFE Produced ALL Species, so while we are against others, esp. civil servants etc.
which are also Humans, which LFE, your "REAL SELF" is part of, has produced.


One can NOT LOVE the "Tree" and HATE the Fruit" nor can one LOVE the "Fruit" and HATE the "Tree".

The "Tree" and the "Fruit" are inseparable !

The biggest hurdle for us to get over, is to Understand WHAT the World is really for,
and NOT tell LIFE what it should be as if we know more than LIFE !

What ever system we choose through the human primate it will self destruct...

So we need to LEARN from LIFE INSTEAD !

Just "Part" of our LESSSON we need to learn !


And YES I suffer the same as You and Others....   So lets do something Practical if we want to overcome
the world !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 08:07:46 pm
Quote
<blockquote>How long before A finds B and they clone brains for robots. The brain is still the best computer on the planet but they are catching up.</blockquote>   
Z: wrote Sooner than you think, my friend...  and right in my backyard  (http://www.thelivingmoon.com/forum/Smileys/default/shocked.gif)


Oh No, there almost here! I can see what they want to do. Thinking ground drones for one on one. they will make transformer type robotos that can blend in with the area until needed to attack. Why not, a ground drone can wait around forever. Look like a tree trunk or blown up car. Just drop the shell and go in for the kill. They need these for tunnels. Drones can only knock out the entrance if it can find it.
Ok, next step "Robodrones" They will sell it as a protection of our troups so they do not have to go into battle. Just a follow up of the air drones with much more capability..
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 08:15:46 pm

Oh No, there almost here! I can see what they want to do. Thinking ground drones for one on one. they will make transformer type robotos that can blend in with the area until needed to attack. Why not, a ground drone can wait around forever. Look like a tree trunk or blown up car. Just drop the shell and go in for the kill. They need these for tunnels. Drones can only knock out the entrance if it can find it.
Ok, next step "Robodrones" They will sell it as a protection of our troups so they do not have to go into battle. Just a follow up of the air drones with much more capability..
 
Deuem

Now there's an idea; Let the machines we build WAR against the other Machines we build,
and Let's get on with LIFE...  :)

That is, a Practical start !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 08:28:12 pm

No, Twitter has new people all the time and millions of readers, We have a very constant 500 membership and a few dozen constant readers/posters.
 
If your not careful on the amount of overload you present to the same few dozen people they will shut down or turn off and the tread dies with a lot of dis-like.
 
This site is the place to figure it out, not spread it out. If the brain power on this site can't figure it out then how are the average sheep going to do it. I think we are all very well informed on the idea and you need to now explore the HOWs.
 
If every twit came here to find out what to do instead of hearing the same spread news, your idea should spread faster and we get more members. In other words finding the same old same old after shifting sites gets old fast and I just click that little close box and move on for new ideas.
 
Maybe present the "next step" daily. And have a next step, not the same one from yesterday. To trip the entire world is like starting it all over again. Not easy.
 
Deuem

I think You missed the point.  THIS is where I point to on twitter for People to read My work, Thor's work, and any other threads that are brought up here that I think should be read.

I was asking if I should be pointing elsewhere...  Mostly being a bit feceous.  Er...facetious.


I work for myself so yea but if worked for a company and the owners wishes were to have a robot work force, I would be wheeled out by a robot. Why would they need me, just to drink the coffee?

You just aren't seeing this.  Ok.  Things get cheaper and cheaper as We add free energy in the place of non-FE, then We go to food, clothing, shelter, water and ask People, do You love what You do or can We fill Your position with someOne who does (or failing that, a robot), give You $2000 a month, or if You're in banking, insurance, advertising, accounting, sales, cashiering, Wall Street, or other position dependent on the money system to even exist, when You lose Your job, until money is fully removed, We'll give You $2,000 a month to.  And if People who are working and are not getting that, We'll give it to Them, too.

Most factories use many robots already.

 
Quote
I think owners would replace workers as fast as they could. Hey no complaints, no medical insurance, no overtime, no vaction time, can work 24/7 and so on regardless if they are paying you.  I saw this happening and I stopped. Changed over to people related automation.
 
There are companies that are doing this now. Canon is one. They call it a black factory. Meaning no lights. All robotic. No people working there except a few syupid people who sweep the floor and oil the machines. The company used to hire real people that wanted to work there. I think that was the 50mm lens factory. So if I wanted to learn optics and make them I am out of luck to work there even if it is for free.
 
I am in a lot of construction/design here from time to time. If we had robots build all of our ghost cities then what do all the workers do. Oil them? If the construction company is robotic then it needs no workers. The diversity of different jobs will slowly come to a halt and then there will be nothing to do except paint a picture or pull weeds. What that really means to a lot of us is that the machines are running the world and I am secondary extra flesh decomposing thinking of what to do next.
 
Deuem needs a reason to live. i am already fat enough. ::)

So...  What You did was thinking in essence, We have a lot of Humans that need jobs, because They need money or They don't survive, and so I will stop work on the robots so We will use Humans as robots so They can feed themselves so that They can perform as robots.

Did I get that right?  Why perpetuate that when Those People can be creating art and science and living richly?

Again, do You love to teach?  Teach.  Do You love to process photos and talk to friends? Do that.  Do You love to build robots?  Do that.  If You need to be paid to motivate You to anything at all, that's sad.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 08:47:56 pm
 
Quote
We have a lot of Humans that need jobs, because They need money or They don't survive

If we take into account ALL the species in the Earth Program the human species is a very, very, small minority,
YET the human species is the ONY Species which NEEDS $$$$$... Now that is very, very, Sad !

$$$$$$$ = Non Cooperation !

Non Cooperation = Failure.... which ever way you like to look at it !

So let's look at things in another way, because we are NOT succeeding at present !
Going by the wares in the market place.

So we need to have a long, long, look at ourselves including myself, and start to LEARN !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 06, 2013, 08:56:07 pm
How many of us have actually watched idiocrasy?wall-E? I-robot ?
If you havent watched these three shows then i would suggest you are out of the loop when it comes to this discussion.combined those three movies sum up the fears of fellow man when it comes to tap.

Here is a timeline.amy requires two things before her idea can come to fruition.free energy and robots.both are projects that i would gladly get involved in.i chatzied flux one night a discussion about peggy building a robot.each of us would adopt a part or limb.each member would be responsible for production of that part.we would still need some engineers to create a full design draft.we lay out this draft and have each volunteer tag what piece they want to create.once all the parts are built then we assemble it and market it.the leftover profits go to peggy.
The next step is free energy.after an open discussion with pwm.i think  we actually can build a free energy device.it will need about 40 solenoids and sixty magnets.the solenoids are about 10$ a piece.the magnets would be donated by pwm.the device would need three flat platters.two for mounting solenoids on and one that spins for mounting magnets in.all three would need to be machined.the spinning one would need to be balanced after magnets are mounted.an axle and a generator/altenator .all mounted on a base.
I know of no free energy device out there so this it what i propose.
Without these two devices.tap is dead.or in limbo.
Jow i have another idea for home protection.mounted turrett rifles with security cameras.nobody is selling them but i bet lots of folks would love to have four stainless rifle turretts mounted on their houses.one on each corner.each would be a 22 caliber so as to severely wound but not kill unless necessary.these would be linked by a droid phone and security cameras.the droid would be a video game setup only real life.and thumbprint recognition.this similar setup was sold for deer hunting for cripples but was outlawed.they have not been outlawed for home security.we could manufacture and sell these through peggy.they would be cheap to make and big profit margine.the profits could then be invested in the peggy robot.
Hows that for a time line.whos in?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 09:15:09 pm
Hi Robo,

Yes seen these movies....

Why O Why, do we need to reproduce the human Species !


Can we only Copy ?

We need to think outside the Square/box and be original !

Like I wrote on the last page....

Quote
Quote
We have a lot of Humans that need jobs, because They need money or They don't survive

If we take into account ALL the species in the Earth Program the human species is a very, very, small minority,

YET the human species is the ONY Species which NEEDS $$$$$... Now that is very, very, Sad !

$$$$$$$ = Non Cooperation !

Non Cooperation = Failure.... which ever way you like to look at it !

So let's look at things in another way, because we are NOT succeeding at present !
Going by the wares in the market place.

So we need to have a long, long, look at ourselves including myself, and start to LEARN !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 09:22:34 pm
I worry that if the need for some type of work, regardless of getting paid or not is removed then the country will fall into a druken/high/couch potato farm. The men here would get together every single night and drink till they drop. Hey no worries about the next day, I might join them. As it is now they drink to much. [not all of them just the elite ones]. I would not become a couch potato but maybe a chair potato. As it is now my butt seems to be attached to my chair daily.
 
On the other hand I can be a lot like PWM when I want to. If everything was free I would need many extra rooms for what I like to do. Oh, the Deuem lab alone would look like star trek. Wall sized monitors and the best computers in the world. I would go from room to room and play with the gagets in each. BUT, as long as I do this, my friends will want the same thing and a race for copy will start. Why not it is free..
 
I guess I really don't understand free. The concept is so far out of my reach I can't see how it could happen. I feel like a sheep, hog tied, wearing binders and in a box with no lid. [Tell that cat to move over or die]
 
I think I am a motivated person "when I want to be". I am also a chair potato when I have the time between those motivation sessions. Which one will win in TAP I don't know. Many people die when they retire because the need for them has stopped. The wood "Need" is another Key. Maybe I am a TAP artist and draw all day, yet no one needs my work, then I get depressed and jump out a window. So just because the chance is there does not mean the need is there. Most people might end up doing worthless things.
 
On the tweeter stuff, sorry, I thought you were posting the same on both and also tagging peggy. I have never even seen twitter. It is banned here. FB I know and have an account there but no I can't get on it either. Same as UT.
 
The guys/gals on Wall street would laugh if you offered them 2K a month The people who sweep the floors get that much. And I am also a little suprised that you mentioned money as any solution? :o
 
Most factories here do not use robots. They like to use labor to keep everyone working. I hear a lot of people on the net say child labor, I say yea, kep the little buggers working 24/7 and take them off them darn computers games on the net. it fries their brains. The computer does all the work and they turn into useless zombies. I see it all the time now. They don't know how to do anything except play these games. So far, 3 parents have hired me to de-program their kids and get them off the addiction and back on a more normal path.
 
With kids, say rich kids that live in the TAP world get fat lazy stupid and think only of what others can do for them. Replace the word "other" with robots and these kids will never be anything more than a wasted generation. I had 1 kid of 12 that was living this life so hard that he had his maid/robot wipe his butt when he took a dump. The robot/maid did everything for him. He did not even know how to tie his own shoes until they had me de-program him. Took about a year and now he is like any other normal kid. But TAP almost killed him. His parents have so much money he could get or ask for anything he wanted. and he did just that ! He was only 12 but the concept seems the same in his eyes...By the way, he never once asked for training..Could care less about learning........
 
Ok, Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 06, 2013, 09:28:02 pm
If my daughter was awake .i would make her read deuems post.

And we sometimes wonder how a psychopath is created.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 09:41:20 pm
The change we seek is NOT going to happen the way we want it to but according to LIFE,
that is the "REAL YOU & ME" NOT by the "flesh".

We have been stuck in a "Rut" for thousands of years, which was required so we could LEARN.

So it is NOW Time to LEARN !

You know that old, old, Saying $$$$$$ is the "Root" of Evil ?

$$$$$$$$ is only a tool to discriminate !

And is fuelled by lack of TRUST in LIFE and suspicion and for some a tool
to Control others. (In Vain)

But for such a change to come about, requires BIRTH !

And like "child labour" it will involve a period of Anguish....

No escaping it, as those on Earth simply won't Change by themselves. History is a witness to this !

So it requires the introduction of more extreme changes controlled by LIFE, NOT Monkeys !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 09:43:59 pm
Robo, thanks. get that USB to work?
 
I have seen those movies and Wall-E is a dirrect put it in your face of TAP going bad. In the movie [cartoon movie] the world filled up with so much junk, people had to leave it. great flick, get by the cartoon and see the meaning in the story.
 
I like to work on the energy device. You have my email and I am one of the players. At least I could do would be to draw it up nice and pretty and figure out the package. Send me what you have and move it to IG.
 
I hope your daughter will get the point. If she does it will make ole Deuem happy.
 
If it were up to me [sorry undo] I would outlaw every video game there is.. It is killing our kids. I would rather have them out side having fun. Kids today don't even know how to jump rope..
 
Abundance is no good and only a waste. meeting needs might be a better term. What does it take to meet the basic needs of the planet. Step 1 ?
 
I Human, need what? vs I Human want what ?  Tap that first......
 
Deuem
 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: rdunk on November 06, 2013, 09:47:36 pm
Now there's an idea; Let the machines we build WAR against the other Machines we build,
and Let's get on with LIFE...  :)

That is, a Practical start !

And of course, the only step left is for the people to devise it so............the robots and machines perform on the basis of the mind-thoughts of the people! And there you have the ultimate of man in the flesh - just as  was revealed to us, in the nightmare results of "The Forbidden Planet"! Man can control much, but not his own thoughts, when the mind is responding to the various external precepts, such as for self-preservation and etc.!!
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 09:49:24 pm
Matrix, Are you saying "No Pain, No Gain"
 
And you lost me on the Life vs Monkeys.......sorry...
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 06, 2013, 10:07:15 pm
Matrix, Are you saying "No Pain, No Gain"
 
And you lost me on the Life vs Monkeys.......sorry...
 
Deuem

LOL....

The Monkey as  referred to is the "Meet Suit" or "human Primate".

LIFE is "AWARENESS" or a bit like Consciousness, i.e. that which experiences both
the Human Primate and the Environment it interacts with.

If you examine your Flesh, NOT a single Component is "Aware" of your "REAL SELF"

But "The REAL YOU" (LIFE or Conscious like "Awareness") is "Aware" of your body your experience....   :)

Check this Fact out...

Am I right or am I right ?   :)

The ONLY thing that can be "Aware" of anything is AWARENESS i.e. LIFE itself !

The "Flesh" or your Avatar in the Program, is NOT "Aware" of anything at all, otherwise it would be called
an "Awareness" and NOT a Human or Species...   :)

Some Know LIFE  :)    and Some Don't.    :(
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 06, 2013, 10:32:09 pm
Thanks deuem.yes i may have you draft something.will start ig thread tonight or in next few days.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 10:43:30 pm
Ok, Life knows the monkey but the monkey does not know life. think I got it. flesh is flesh and unaware of its self...it is just a reaction from life Other wise I would be talking to my fingers and they would listen better when I type.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 06, 2013, 11:03:48 pm

If we take into account ALL the species in the Earth Program the human species is a very, very, small minority,
YET the human species is the ONY Species which NEEDS $$$$$... Now that is very, very, Sad !

$$$$$$$ = Non Cooperation !

Non Cooperation = Failure.... which ever way you like to look at it !

So let's look at things in another way, because we are NOT succeeding at present !
Going by the wares in the market place.

So we need to have a long, long, look at ourselves including myself, and start to LEARN !

Yes.  as You say, BINGO! on the "$$$$$$$ = Non Cooperation !

Non Cooperation = Failure.... which ever way you like to look at it !"

That is why TAP promises to function so well.  No money, so We do things because We care, and We WILL see grand cooperation, Conscious co-creation, even, IF We throw off the bonds of money and the power it gives the most psychopathic on the planet.

And z keeps saying "just happens," but if We all have a goal to make something happen, without money the bulk of Us NONpsychopathic will steer.  The ideas are the trace; Our efforts in that direction is the stigmergic response.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 06, 2013, 11:14:46 pm
Ok, I am not posting this picture to be a funny Deuem, It is here to show you what I think will happen to the kids living in abundance. As it is now they are getting to be about 25% of the kid in the photo. They are an easy mark. Only the fat kids have rich parents. Move it up to when they are all in abundance and we might get this across the board. I see it every day.
 
 
 
(http://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/aa458/deuem/TapinactioninChina.jpg) (http://s1198.photobucket.com/user/deuem/media/TapinactioninChina.jpg.html)
 
 
I see little difference between rich kids and a bad Tap future for all of them. Hey if China the land of 1.3 billion people can go from a 3rd world hunger state to a bliss of food. So much we can toss it out then what is wrong with other places. I quess they just don't care.
 
And after that bird is done eating the kid I would line his/her parents up next.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 07, 2013, 01:49:11 am
Quote
Ok, Life knows the monkey but the monkey does not know life. think I got it. flesh is flesh and unaware of its self...it is just a reaction from life Other wise I would be talking to my fingers and they would listen better when I type.

LOL... I couldn't put it better myself.....  LOL

I will remember your comments, as it is a beautiful way of putting it... Good on you D......  :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 07, 2013, 02:11:45 am
Quote
That is why TAP promises to function so well.  No money, so We do things because We care, and We WILL see grand cooperation, Conscious co-creation, even

As I keep telling you nothing wrong with your desires and thoughts to change BUT, I hate that BUT.... Don't you?

There are very few of us, who want things to change, the other 90% just WANT !

When I was a baby I just WANTED..... That is why I cried. I didn't want to learn how to crawl and walk
I just wanted to be picked up and carried, just like others...  But my dear mum insisted I learn to crawl,
then walk, so I could go out to play, become a little educated etc. etc. You know how it is... Mums care
for their children...   :)

So NOW it is TIME for us ALL including me, to Learn about Our Real Selves and WHAT this is really all about,
instead of believing anything which will allow us to find an easy way, avoiding any effort.


So will everyone change then ?

I hate to say it but I can't see it happening....

Everyone has to LEARN themselves, through Experiencing this Program, (World) just Like
I learnt to Crawl and walk etc. as a baby.

But the baby stage passes and we then go out to play and gain a little more education.

The Best education of ALL comes from Living....   :)

Also known as The PRESENT !

Present;

a.     The "NOW".
and
b.      A "GIFT".

That is why these two are spelt the same.....  LOL.

Plain to see and undeniable.   :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Sinny on November 07, 2013, 02:46:00 am
Sooner than you think, my friend...  and right in my backyard  :o

Pentagon’s DARPA preparing to equip robots with ‘real’ brains

(http://rt.com/files/news/1e/b5/50/00/rtr18zqx.si.jpg)
A robotics fan wears a button on his hat at the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) Grand Challenge in Primm Nevada. (Reuters / Gene Blevins)


http://rt.com/usa/systems-intelligence-robots-defense-781/

Peter Beter said they, ('they' being either the White Russians or the Americans, can't remember which), already cracked this little endeavor back in the 70's.

I'm inclined to believe him now some of the information is starting to filter through.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 07, 2013, 03:01:15 am
We can only choose from the choices, which have been written into the (independent) "Species Program".

IF the choice is NOT available in our own Program we can't enable the choice which is NOT there
before we enter the experience.

I Can explain more about this in my private forums...

I might even open a new thread in my pubic forum regarding this, when I get back from China early next year,
IF I don't stay in China at this stage.

Can't read a Program Book if it hasn't been written, before one attempts to read it, re. your experience involving
this world or Program.

The" Program Book" being "The Life and Times of"....... (with all the available choices)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 07, 2013, 04:37:19 am
I thought the brain was mapped last year.i would think it would be simple to take that map and place on a microchip.then the brain can download itself using a mirror program.viola.cloned.just a theory though.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 07, 2013, 05:01:21 am
Quote
I might even open a new thread in my pubic forum regarding this, when I get back from China early next year,
IF I don't stay in China at this stage.


Breaking new, Pegasus is taking over China, you heard it here first.....The Zorgon empire is expanding to the world..
 
Sorry, got off topic...Mental moment is now over,
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Sinny on November 07, 2013, 05:46:59 am
then the brain can download itself using a mirror program.viola.cloned.just a theory though.

Good theory IMO.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 08:18:02 am
Ok, I am not posting this picture to be a funny Deuem, It is here to show you what I think will happen to the kids living in abundance. As it is now they are getting to be about 25% of the kid in the photo. They are an easy mark. Only the fat kids have rich parents. Move it up to when they are all in abundance and we might get this across the board. I see it every day.
 
 
 
(http://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/aa458/deuem/TapinactioninChina.jpg) (http://s1198.photobucket.com/user/deuem/media/TapinactioninChina.jpg.html)
 
 
I see little difference between rich kids and a bad Tap future for all of them. Hey if China the land of 1.3 billion people can go from a 3rd world hunger state to a bliss of food. So much we can toss it out then what is wrong with other places. I quess they just don't care.
 
And after that bird is done eating the kid I would line his/her parents up next.
 
Deuem

So...  Is there any HFCS in the food there?  MSG?  Other system disruptors like Aspartame?  And yeah, some percentage of Humans will choose to be like that guy - BUT...  What skin is it off YOUR nose?  No One is a "burden" in TAP.  And while We're at it, what BUSINESS is it of Yours?

EDIT to add:  I see images with thousands of normal Chinese kids - I cannot imagine that China has a weight problem.  And if the issue is merely overeating, that is a sign of low self esteem, and One cannot rule out things like:  effective abandonment (little to no attention given) and/or abuse (verbal, physical, sexual), as overweight is VASTLY more common a problem amongst children who are so neglected and treated.

And since the rich tend to be psychopaths, One can give a higher likelihood to the possibility that indeed these children have been maltreated.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 08:35:37 am
As I keep telling you nothing wrong with your desires and thoughts to change BUT, I hate that BUT.... Don't you?

There are very few of us, who want things to change, the other 90% just WANT !

When I was a baby I just WANTED..... That is why I cried. I didn't want to learn how to crawl and walk
I just wanted to be picked up and carried, just like others...  But my dear mum insisted I learn to crawl,
then walk, so I could go out to play, become a little educated etc. etc. You know how it is... Mums care
for their children...   :)

So NOW it is TIME for us ALL including me, to Learn about Our Real Selves and WHAT this is really all about,
instead of believing anything which will allow us to find an easy way, avoiding any effort.


So will everyone change then ?

I hate to say it but I can't see it happening....

Everyone has to LEARN themselves, through Experiencing this Program, (World) just Like
I learnt to Crawl and walk etc. as a baby.

But the baby stage passes and we then go out to play and gain a little more education.

The Best education of ALL comes from Living....   :)

Also known as The PRESENT !

Present;

a.     The "NOW".
and
b.      A "GIFT".

That is why these two are spelt the same.....  LOL.

Plain to see and undeniable.   :)

Matrix, what makes You think:

1.  That wanting will not motivate People to change to a system where They can have
2.  That effort as an energy slave is superior to effort put forth in bliss
3.  That having the ability to CHOOSE where Our energy is spent is inferior to being forced to fit Our energy in as a cog in the system or die
4.  That starving to death as a child is within acceptable parameters when the planet could easily feed every child for centuries
5.  That We should retain the system when We JUST NOW (and never before - that We know of) have the tools to change it

?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 07, 2013, 10:52:34 am
I thought the brain was mapped last year.i would think it would be simple to take that map and place on a microchip.then the brain can download itself using a mirror program.viola.cloned.just a theory though.

The Bain is also an "Interface" between The Mind i.e. Awareness or LIFE
and the Experience (body and Environment it Interacts with, which is much like a "1st Person"
Computer game played on a network with multiple players in a common software environment.)

1st Person Computer Game;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-person_(video_games)

But what you believe to be Reality is a "1st person" game but slightly more sophisticated
than what is played on the net today....  LOL.



Yes the Brain has been mapped like you say but this does NOT give the Software
nor "Source Code".

The Brains Processor doesn't function like our CRUDE computers.

The brain is like a "Pseudo Processor", supporting its peripherals, but within the System exists the "Interface"
to LIFE or "Awareness" which is Non Dimensional.



So HOW do we map something which is Non Dimensional and NOT a Component of the Experience ?   :)

We can However both see our Processing System and study it in this "Non-Dimensional" World,
as a "Projection" through Strobing Light on a Screen.... or Rapidly blinking your eyes
at a White Surface such as a Wall, making sure NOT to move the eyes.

The Processing System is Constructed on "Rules" or "Laws" involving "Interactive Geometry", so there is
Nothing Physical or formed of Energy about this processor outside the human environment....  :)

There is a huge amount for us to learn yet about "Virtual" like Processors.

In reality our "Human based Science" is rather Primitive, and lacks all the Cards....  LOL.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 07, 2013, 10:59:35 am
Quote
then the brain can download itself using a mirror program.viola.cloned.just a theory though.

Good theory IMO.

Absolutely correct Robot... My occupation involves exactly that !    :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 07, 2013, 11:25:26 am
Quote
Matrix, what makes You think:

1stly The KNOWLEDGE of LIFE (To Know LIFE)   

Quote
1.  That wanting will not motivate People to change to a system where They can have

Because the human primate is the Result, simply a Component of a "1st person" game
and is certainly NOT in Control !

IF they were then your world would be different and you wouldn't be looking at changes now would you ?

Quote
2.  That effort as an energy slave is superior to effort put forth in bliss

Why O Why does the human Primate "LUST" after "Energy Based Systems" ?

Quote
3.  That having the ability to CHOOSE where Our energy is spent is inferior to being forced to fit
Our energy in as a cog in the system or die

"Energy", "Energy", "Energy".... see Quote;

Quote
Why O Why does the human Primate, "LUST" after "Energy Based Systems" ?

Quote
4.  That starving to death as a child is within acceptable parameters when the planet could easily feed every child for centuries

It isn't Acceptable !

The Flesh can't die, simply because it Isn't Living in the 1st Place.   :)

The ONLY "Lining One" is LIFE, Nothing else.... Its just that on Earth
you WANT the Flesh to be alive...   :)

The Dead is NOTalive !

Neither can "The Living One" Die !


The Flesh is NOT LIFE... it is "flesh", part of an experience which is Generated from Program Books !


It is so Sad, that many on Earth try to Covet LIFE ! (in Vain)

Perhaps it is "Envy" ?

Quote
5.  That We should retain the system when We JUST NOW (and never before - that We know of) have the tools to change it

You can't Change it.... because the "Option" is NOT Present in the Program !


LIFE is in Control.... Thank Goodness !

It's just that its purpose is NOT understood Through the Brain of a human Primate..
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 01:34:54 pm
Breaking new, Pegasus is taking over China, you heard it here first.....The Zorgon empire is expanding to the world..

You gotz free medical over there right?  :D

I may move :P
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 02:19:56 pm
I guess...  Does that mean I should stop posting My work here and direct Twits to other sites...?

Nope didn't say that nor imply that. If I thought you were spamming us I would not have given you a section :P 

Quote
Not exactly.  The People with the heart and skills WILL emerge.  I rely on the natural stigmergy inherent in all social creatures.  I don't have the expertise, but I can point the path easily enough.

Perhaps those with the heart are already here... and I would grant as given that the skills exist already... what is missing is the method for those with heart and skill to start the wheels turning. No matter what you say... MONEY will be needed to start the process of getting rid of money.  You cannot build a new empire with nothing but an idea. The first robot factory will be expensive


Quote
Little illustration:

There is a planet with 100 People on it.  It's a very small planet, but could support 1000.  The fields need 25 People (just grabbing a number) to work them.  14 People LOVE to farm.  They step right up.

They still need 11 more.  They have a choice.  Force, coerce, or bribe 11 People to work the fields - OR add 11 robots, freeing the 11 to do what They WANT to do.

One thing wrong with your illustration. Yes they have a choice... chip in to the farming or STARVE. In the old hunter gatherer systems everyone chipped in to provide food for the tribe. It was either that or starve. Then someone smart figured out that if they enslave the neighbors they could eat free :P and that is how war was born :D

Quote
No One is FORCING robots on anyOne, but that they are used where necessary work needs to be done and too few WANT to do it.

In theory on paper that might work... in reality it will not. Robots are already filling the task in many bad jobs today... but the robot makers are mad scientists. They are working daily to make their machines smarter and better than us. The signs are all around us... the Japanese are even wanting robots to replace women for pure sexual reasons... (although one guy did program the bot to say no and slap ya when you touch her boob :P )  I bet within my lifetime I will see very awesome sexbots hit the market. probably cheaper than the wife :P

You forget that those with the skills and ideas to build robots tend to be the geeky types that care only to make the best smartest robots... very rarely do they care about humanity in general

And that is not counting your psychopaths that are currently mass producing robots of destruction... from drones to petman to micro bugs to replace Bees

Quote
You can go live in that yert on the Mongolian steppes I keep bringing up, or in a cave, no robots to be seen.

LOL I have a portable one :P

(http://www.yourtent.com/images/gallery/zajimav/yurtwheel.jpg)

They are comfy :D and the Mongolian steppes are awesome but cold...  though I am pretty sure Mongolians won't support TAP

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 02:24:14 pm
Whoa!  Who put ANY religious spin in here?  I am not "against religion!"  I have My own view, and that's that, but I would NEVER push ANYONE around on THEIR spiritual path.  In TAP, communities of worshipers will likely spring up.  One can follow ANY path One CHOOSES and as long as One does not break the three Laws, who cares?

Well religion IS part of this You cannot brush it away.  HOW will you get 23% of the world's population that is Muslim to accept TAP and obey your "Three laws" when their mission in life, their bliss, is to have the world under Allah's rule?

Buddhists already kinda support "do your own thing" but Christians are more interested it seeing the End of the World then worrying about fixing things
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 02:47:04 pm
Nope didn't say that nor imply that. If I thought you were spamming us I would not have given you a section :P 

Ok.

Quote
Perhaps those with the heart are already here... and I would grant as given that the skills exist already... what is missing is the method for those with heart and skill to start the wheels turning. No matter what you say... MONEY will be needed to start the process of getting rid of money.  You cannot build a new empire with nothing but an idea. The first robot factory will be expensive

Yes...  Thus the call to spend taxes - which is part of the ideas I spread.  Because if no One knows  to spend, We will not make that choice.

Quote
One thing wrong with your illustration. Yes they have a choice... chip in to the farming or STARVE. In the old hunter gatherer systems everyone chipped in to provide food for the tribe. It was either that or starve. Then someone smart figured out that if they enslave the neighbors they could eat free :P and that is how war was born :D

The illustration was presuming the new tools We just now have.  Or did that get past You?  Yes, in energy scarcity, that is what drove People: survival.  With the advent of devices to use external energy, some of that scarcity was relieved, enough to allow Us some leisure time.  As more and more external energy was added, life got better and better.  That is a threat to TPTB, because Humans, freed from focusing purely on survival, are able to focus on the system They are within.

So the "oil scarcity" myth, for one example, came into being.  It allowed Them to tighten the purse strings on Us, sucking greater amounts of wealth from Us to Them. 

And now, having figured out how to free Us from slavery (paid, unpaid, indebted cog) and any profit from war, We all can live abundantly with expectations of overall peace.

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In theory on paper that might work... in reality it will not. Robots are already filling the task in many bad jobs today... but the robot makers are mad scientists. They are working daily to make their machines smarter and better than us. The signs are all around us... the Japanese are even wanting robots to replace women for pure sexual reasons... (although one guy did program the bot to say no and slap ya when you touch her boob :P )  I bet within my lifetime I will see very awesome sexbots hit the market. probably cheaper than the wife :P

You forget that those with the skills and ideas to build robots tend to be the geeky types that care only to make the best smartest robots... very rarely do they care about humanity in general

And You forget the power of bragging rights for producing the BEST solutions.  I bet, as with Linux, efforts to offer best solutions will be common.  Difficult to be psychopathic in coding when source is available for all to pour through, seeing what You're doing and how You're doing it.  Get caught and MAN the negative social currency will pile up.

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And that is not counting your psychopaths that are currently mass producing robots of destruction... from drones to petman to micro bugs to replace Bees

Stigmergy will allow the solutions to emerge.  And the present psychopaths will become personally responsible for Their choices of behavior, as the rest of Us.  They will discover They are only 4%ish...

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LOL I have a portable one :P

(http://www.yourtent.com/images/gallery/zajimav/yurtwheel.jpg)

They are comfy :D and the Mongolian steppes are awesome but cold...  though I am pretty sure Mongolians won't support TAP

I wouldn't mind a yert, M'self.  As for the Mongolians...  What do They have to do to "support" it?  They continue as They choose.  If They want something from outside, They find a terminal eventually, and order it.  If They don't, They can ignore any terminals They see, should They see any.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 02:55:09 pm
No "maybe" about it in My experience.  Whether You choose to believe or not...  Meh.  Nothing I can do about it.

Oh, I assure You, SOMEONE has it.  But again, that is from personal experience.  Believe, don't.  Whatever.

It's not a matter of belief... it is a matter of direct evidence. Sure there may be some devices tucked away somewhere but you forget about GREED

While the US and some other nations may be happy with the Oil Barons.... there are other 'psychopathic despots' in the world that have no access to oil and are dependent on it to survive.

Those guys would pounce on it, develop it in secret and use it for their own advancement... instead of being at the mercy of oil. Hitler was brought to his knees literally because we cut off the oil...

Yet CTer's say Hitler had Alien help and advanced saucer tech...

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And You don't think They might be:

1.  Keeping use localized where They know They won't have to explain it
2.  Putting in such places (on Our dime) to enrich contractors and hide the actual mainstay of power production

Could be.  I put nothing past Them.

I used to think that maybe  yes "could be" But now I know that it's not. They are spending trillions on our dime yes, but unless this 'free energy' tech is being used off world, it is not being used here.  And even the NAVY is using laser transmission to beam wireless energy to Moon Base :P
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 02:59:31 pm
The illustration was presuming the new tools We just now have.  Or did that get past You?

No but where are these new tools?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 03:06:40 pm
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Frankly, such bumbling would look very much like They didn't know what They were doing and therefore not suspect.  Meanwhile, the real task at hand, breaking Humanity and establishing a psychopath-run New World Order, goes on.  They really don't care if We struggle, in Our part of Their puppet show.

Well Frank back atcha :P

All I have to do is listen to these bozos to see that the bumbling is not an act, like that lady in the federal reserve 9 trillion video. As to the psychopath-run New World Order, they already outnumber everyone else according to conspiracy theorists. You yourself said ALL news is fake...

If all news is fake, how do you convince people your news isn't?  I see it here at Pegasus... 90% of what I present is never seen, ignored or goes in one ear and out the other.  If I spent half the time I spend posting listing stuff on Ebay I would be rich and able to go see Australia etc :D

There are over 120 spook agencies... Jack says it's closer to 500. They employ millions of people. Then you have the TSA, Blackberry, Cops, FEMA, etc etc etc.

Hard to beat that especially since THEY have the robots on their side already
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 03:14:23 pm
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With the internet global system... if there WAS a true working device that would fall under "Free energy" it would be virtually impossible to stop it going viral

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So...  You're saying the tech in the deepest of the depths of black projects is surely out on the web by now?  Am I catching Your drift?

No you missed my drift entirely.

I am saying with all the inventors out there with claimed working free energy gizmos... and the existeance of both the internet and the pirate network, IF there was a working free energy device that was viable, the PTB could NOT stop it from going viral.

The recent shut down of the internet in Egypt proved that point. Despite all efforts to keep it contained... the info got out anyway

John Searl is alive and kicking as are thousands of inventors even working on nuclear fusion devices all over the internet.

They are all alive and sharing.

Maybe if one of them actually makes one work, then 'da gubment' may step in...

But in my opinion, no one has made the breakthrough yet

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I will bet enough toadies will come forth if the ideas reach Them.  Us sharp monkeys I think I can rely on...too. 

Agreed... that is what I am saying...  IF there was a working idea, it would reach the smart monkey toadies and go viral.  Since these smart monkey toadies haven't built it yet is proof that no viable, recreatable idea has yet hit the network
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 05:46:12 pm
It's not a matter of belief... it is a matter of direct evidence. Sure there may be some devices tucked away somewhere but you forget about GREED

While the US and some other nations may be happy with the Oil Barons.... there are other 'psychopathic despots' in the world that have no access to oil and are dependent on it to survive.

Those guys would pounce on it, develop it in secret and use it for their own advancement... instead of being at the mercy of oil. Hitler was brought to his knees literally because we cut off the oil...

Uh...  That assumes "Those guys" have the tech - or are even necessarily aware of it.  Sure, if the tech was Theirs.  But *I* think it is so well hidden THEY don't have it (and why WE out here don't have it either.  But, as I have said before, when the toadies realize They can live as richly or likely even more so, enough will come to the fore, and failing that, the rest of Us will develop it independently.

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I used to think that maybe  yes "could be" But now I know that it's not. They are spending trillions on our dime yes, but unless this 'free energy' tech is being used off world, it is not being used here.  And even the NAVY is using laser transmission to beam wireless energy to Moon Base :P

Where is the energy being beamed coming from?  Do We see an energy bill?  Just sayin'.  And I propose that You don't know that it is not being used here in SOME capacity.

Like I said, They hold THAT tech close to Their chest; if it gets out, They lose Their power over the rest of Us.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 05:48:58 pm
No but where are these new tools?

1.  Free energy:  Black projects

2.  Robotics:  Look around

3.  Interweb:  Look where You're looking.

4.  Personal recording ability:  look on Your mobile phone (if it's only a few years old)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 05:59:31 pm
Maybe if one of them actually makes one work, then 'da gubment' may step in...

Guaranteed, and there is plenty of evidence that this has happened many times in the past.  Things like the guy My friend worked for who had an invention, all His own work, that My friend would set up and take down for demonstrations looking for investors.  He said the machine was overunity, and worked quite well.

One day the FBI swooped in and took everything and charged the inventor for patent violation (even though the patent in question was buried and not available).  Convicted the guy too.  Destroyed Him.

So yeah, when success happens They WILL try to suppress.

But in my opinion, no one has made the breakthrough yet

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Agreed... that is what I am saying...  IF there was a working idea, it would reach the smart monkey toadies and go viral.  Since these smart monkey toadies haven't built it yet is proof that no viable, recreatable idea has yet hit the network

No, no.  The TOADIES already know, but are paid for Their silence (and threatened...).  The People on the outside of black projects are NOT toadies.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 07, 2013, 08:02:52 pm
I guess I am still hung up on what free energy really means
 
If I build a wind mill and the wind gives me power is it free energy or energy/cost of said wind mill
 
If I make 115 at the cost of 100 million per gram and it gives me enregy is it energy/cost
 
The only thing I know of that is 100% free is sunlight. The minute we use it there is a cost.
 
free would mean that I take a+b make c, minus the cost of ab and still get more c. I have not seen this yet. Nuke power is the closest so far. 1 million times the power of oil. If the radiation was not a problem they would be god sent. Energy seems to have a cost no matter how it is made.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 08:41:37 pm
Like I said, They hold THAT tech close to Their chest; if it gets out, They lose Their power over the rest of Us.

That is your assessment... and I can see why you need to hold that thought...

However I don't agree with your assessment.

And if it IS that well hidden that the Military doesn't have access to it either, let alone "We the inventor peeps..." then it is a moot point anyway because by that logic the toadies will never get it.

At least if the Military had it some would trickle out. It always does and always has, albeit 30 years late

So if it is so hidden that the War Fighters cannot access it... then of what use is it?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 07, 2013, 08:54:12 pm
I guess I am still hung up on what free energy really means

"Let me be PERFECTLY clear...." ~ Richard Tricky Dicky Nixon
 
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If I build a wind mill and the wind gives me power is it free energy or energy/cost of said wind mill

Correct  and a little for maintenance... but ANY energy system requires initial setup costs and building devices to harness and us it
 
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The only thing I know of that is 100% free is sunlight. The minute we use it there is a cost.

This is incorrect  plasma energy is free... just harness the lightning.  Water power is free, just stick a wheel in the stream and let gravity do the work... wind is free... but you need a windmill. firewood is free... but you need a stove to burn it in and some effort to chop the wood.

All these are obviously free AFTER initial costs. So by that rule a mill puts a water wheel in a stream and gets free energy to power that mill. But at the same time when we make a hydro electric dam, it is really a glorified water wheel. You could effectively make 10 dams in series on a river and use the same water to generate 10 times the power.  This was proposed and offered in Canada. All the US had to do was put in the power lines. It would have created 10 lakes for fishing and storing fresh water and be able to make a hydrogen plant at the same time...

Power generated at a dam is FREE ENERGY... what you pay for is the service to bring it to your door. If you had your own river you could generate your own

But when we speak of FREE ENERGY in the conspiracy world and fringe science world... they mean OVER UNITY... a device that puts out more energy than it takes to run it

While a power dam is technically free because nature provides the water and gravity and that is not used up... it is not free in the OVER UNITY sense because you are merely converting one form to another... gravity uses water to tuns wheel kinetic energy... wheel turns copper coil within a magnetic field... voila!!! magically we get a flow of electrons  (which NO ONE on the planet knows what electriicty really is :P )

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 07, 2013, 09:53:31 pm
I guess I am still hung up on what free energy really means
 
If I build a wind mill and the wind gives me power is it free energy or energy/cost of said wind mill
 
If I make 115 at the cost of 100 million per gram and it gives me enregy is it energy/cost
 
The only thing I know of that is 100% free is sunlight. The minute we use it there is a cost.
 
free would mean that I take a+b make c, minus the cost of ab and still get more c. I have not seen this yet. Nuke power is the closest so far. 1 million times the power of oil. If the radiation was not a problem they would be god sent. Energy seems to have a cost no matter how it is made.
 
Deuem

Yes, windmill power, if it's Your windmill, is free energy.  But also, any device that outputs more energy than input to run it.  When the extraction methods from the plenum ("vacuum") are released/rediscovered, We will have all the energy We can use.  Initially We will have to pay for these but once free energy is flowing, money will vanish, and any additional machines will be free.

That is your assessment... and I can see why you need to hold that thought...

However I don't agree with your assessment.

And if it IS that well hidden that the Military doesn't have access to it either, let alone "We the inventor peeps..." then it is a moot point anyway because by that logic the toadies will never get it.

At least if the Military had it some would trickle out. It always does and always has, albeit 30 years late

So if it is so hidden that the War Fighters cannot access it... then of what use is it?

Disagree all You want.  But it is FACT that all money accounts for meaningful energy expended.  Adding free energy WILL remove the need for money and thereby strip the "elite" of their power.

And I say it is FACT that They DO have ways of extracting energy from the plenum.  But again, it's merely My experience.  Belief by Others is optional.

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 08, 2013, 12:09:20 am
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This is incorrect  plasma energy is free... just harness the lightning.  Water power is free, just stick a wheel in the stream and let gravity do the work... wind is free... but you need a windmill. firewood is free... but you need a stove to burn it in and some effort to chop the wood.

All these are obviously free AFTER initial costs. [snip]

Z, I meant 100% free, even in your own notes you added after initial costs.
 
Take plants to the sun, they have no setup costs to drain the power they take except the act of being alive. Humans can not just lay in the sun to get fed nor can I get and extension cord long enough to plug into it.
 
Now if setup costs are low and output is very high then it works well. Nukes were suposed to do that, guess they lied on that one. One million times the power of Oil.....
 
Even over unity needs an initial kick to start. i guess we will only need 1 to get them all going..like falling Dominos?
 
I would like to see something that anyone can have, just to give them power and not rely on any power grids and break that cycle. Even if all I have to do is to add a cup of something once a week to make it happen. That something has to be cheap like salt or pixie dust.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 01:31:10 am
The answers do NOT exist in the World, because it is the end result and NOT the cause !

But you can find ALL the answers in the Place, where your experience (body and environment) is generated !

What I don't understand   :o  is why no one will do this ....... or even try  ::)

You can achieve this IF only you will try !   :)

LIFE wants to reveal ALL to you.... IF Only you would accept LIFE... and let LIFE show you.

There is NO Greater "Teacher" than LIFE !

All you have to do, is discover the "Real Self" and Its "Outer" End.

IF you discover this, then you shall find ALL the Answers.

They may be different that what you desire or expect, but never the less these Answers will be correct.


If you learn to Ask The RIGHT "Questions", you Shall find the Right Answers !

But if you Ask The Wrong Questions you Shall find the Wrong Answers
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: PLAYSWITHMACHINES on November 08, 2013, 07:44:03 am
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Agreed... that is what I am saying...  IF there was a working idea, it would reach the smart monkey toadies and go viral.  Since these smart monkey toadies haven't built it yet is proof that no viable, recreatable idea has yet hit the network

A lot of them have gone viral, even though many are fakes, which makes it harder to spot the real ones.

The whole point of the I.G. is to evaluate and replicate all these devices, find the one that works best, and publish the plans, AFTER we put something on the market so we have some funding for the next stage.

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voila!!! magically we get a flow of electrons  (which NO ONE on the planet knows what electriicty really is  )

Eggzactly, but i have seen these magical electron flows give a 4.8:1 power difference, so effectively, i have witnessed true overunity. Of course the energy was not created, it came from somewhere, we're not quite sure where, but hey, if it works, it works ;)

Matrix, i understand your approach being 'why do we need all this energy' but it's part of the cure, like money is.
Z is right, you will need a lot of money to set up a money-free system.... ???

So is it with energy also, we need LOTS of it, in order to get out of this rut & get some real science done, where we will no longer be talking in terms of 'how much energy does this device use?'..it will simply draw what it needs from Nature to do it's job, however much that may be, LOL
Later!

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 08:34:50 am
The answers do NOT exist in the World, because it is the end result and NOT the cause !

But you can find ALL the answers in the Place, where your experience (body and environment) is generated !

What I don't understand   :o  is why no one will do this ....... or even try  ::)

You can achieve this IF only you will try !   :)

LIFE wants to reveal ALL to you.... IF Only you would accept LIFE... and let LIFE show you.

There is NO Greater "Teacher" than LIFE !

All you have to do, is discover the "Real Self" and Its "Outer" End.

IF you discover this, then you shall find ALL the Answers.

They may be different that what you desire or expect, but never the less these Answers will be correct.


If you learn to Ask The RIGHT "Questions", you Shall find the Right Answers !

But if you Ask The Wrong Questions you Shall find the Wrong Answers

Matrix, it may be that no One knows what "trying" actually means...  Do We hold Our breath?  Do We stand on Our heads?

How does One learn to "ask the right questions?"  How does this asking take place?  Seems to Me that the mess on this planet that We're in is because We did not know there were questions to be asked, let alone the "right" ones.

So now what?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 08:43:31 am
Now if setup costs are low and output is very high then it works well. Nukes were suposed to do that, guess they lied on that one. One million times the power of Oil.....
 
Even over unity needs an initial kick to start. i guess we will only need 1 to get them all going..like falling Dominos?

Even if the costs are high and the output low, doesn't matter.  As long as, over time, You see a net positive output, You have free energy, which will help remove the cost of things so that initial expenditure is irrelevant.

And yes, once one is in place and running, there will be a domino effect.
 
Quote
I would like to see something that anyone can have, just to give them power and not rely on any power grids and break that cycle. Even if all I have to do is to add a cup of something once a week to make it happen. That something has to be cheap like salt or pixie dust.

Not to worry.  "Plugins" will become available to run non-FE running items.  This will remove Us from the grid, and being free to do as We CHOOSE, We can then "go camping" anywhere on the planet and have all Our ammenities.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 08, 2013, 12:42:40 pm
A lot of them have gone viral, even though many are fakes, which makes it harder to spot the real ones.

Sadly that is the case in just about every field these days... for every one true story, 99 are false.  :(

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The whole point of the I.G. is to evaluate and replicate all these devices, find the one that works best, and publish the plans, AFTER we put something on the market so we have some funding for the next stage.

Yup counting on you guys :P  They just upped my power bill to $400.00 a month average now  AARRGGGGG

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Eggzactly, but i have seen these magical electron flows give a 4.8:1 power difference, so effectively, i have witnessed true overunity. Of course the energy was not created, it came from somewhere, we're not quite sure where, but hey, if it works, it works ;)

That has been my take on Overunity... no 'something from nothing' which defies the laws and gets the skeptics hot under the collar... but from a yet to be identified source. Considering that there is plasma all over the Universe... and considering that you can collect mega volts by simply dragging a copper wire through the earth's magnetic field (FREE ENERGY :P) it is likely that there is a constant stream of energy that we can simply dip into.

We KNOW the copper wire drag works... but what about this?

A tether  flies in orbit at orbital speeds of 17,500 mph. (I don't know how that speed compares to the coil in a hydro electric generator)

The earth is a giant magnet flying through space. We know that electrons are out there. The earth is moving at about 2 MILLION miles per hour as we sit in our chairs.

Somehow I am thinking that the potential of this high speed movement of a magnet through an energy stream HAS to do something :D

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Matrix, i understand your approach being 'why do we need all this energy' but it's part of the cure, like money is.
Z is right, you will need a lot of money to set up a money-free system.... ???

I agree with Matrix.  All my life I have sought after the esoteric knowledge. Jesus told us we could move a mountain with a mere thought. Religious idgits tell us he meant that figuratively (because their puny minds cannot accept the reality :P ) but no he meant it literally as we see in the story of the fig tree added later..."What? No figs? Then shrivel and DIE tree"  :P

Yoda told us the same thing... that by simply believing in the Force, we can move that spaceship

The SECRET, Law of Attraction, works the same way  THOUGHT BECOMES THINGS

THINK AND GROW RICH (that has been working for me on a starting level)

MIND OVER MATTER - used to be all sorts of experiments in telekenisis

Quantum physics says electrons behave differently when we focus on them.  Literally Mind over Matter

Quantum physics tells us that two particles apart by any amount of distance communicate INSTANTLY  (speed of thought is faster than light :P )

I think that we are looking at life completely WRONG... but we are stuck in that paradigm :P

Why can we not move mountains? Why is it all we can manage is small parlor tricks? Because we are still in Kindergarten level and have a LONG way to go before we can master the Force wisely

THIS is why secret societies were created. We were well on the way thousands of years ago and then religion stepped in and put us back into the Dark Ages. Not the belief, but the religion that is merely man's interpretation of what he cannot comprehend

All the great minds new the Secret and used it

"The earth is a cradle of the mind, but one cannot live in a cradle forever."

Konstantin E. Tsiolkovsky
Father of Russian Astronautics, 1896

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So is it with energy also, we need LOTS of it, in order to get out of this rut & get some real science done, where we will no longer be talking in terms of 'how much energy does this device use?'..it will simply draw what it needs from Nature to do it's job, however much that may be, LOL

So why has no one recreated T H Morray's little box? Why has no one been able to explain T H Morray's little box?  That little box could plug anything you had directly int the force :D

(http://www.thmoray.org/images/moray&device.jpg)

Now THAT is free energy  One of those in every home... problem solved

UNLESS...

Since we don't know WHERE the energy is coming from... what if we are taking it from somewhere it needs to be?

TESLA discovered wireless power... people thing that meant Free Energy... but in reality that was simply generating power at point A converting it to radio waves and re converting it to electricity at point B  The REASON he got into trouble with that was he still had to tap into Niagara falls generating plant to get the power to transmit. That was when Westinghouse said "Where can I put the meter?"  Since he was paying for the dam and generating plant that Tesla was LEACHING from :P  well you get the idea :D

Also consider this... if ALL the power we use today was being beamed through the air, imagine all the cancer we would cause by the increased transmission. That is a LOT of power to transmit to run modern society. I am sure considering how upset people are over current levels of microwaves, adding that much power in the airwaves WOULD literally fry brain cells ;)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 08, 2013, 12:54:01 pm
1.  Free energy:  Black projects

Unproven yet and unaccessible IF it exists... so it is like giving a radiation detector to a caveman

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2.  Robotics:  Look around

Have been. Yes I said robots are-a-commin... but what I see is a HUGE force of military bots ready to force THEIR paradigm down your throat. They have a head start. THEY are using that tool against us. Can we snatch that tool from them before it's too late?

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3.  Interweb:  Look where You're looking.

80-90% of what is on the web is total cow puckies... and those listening to the crap have ZERO interest in hearing the truth because it goes against what they WANT to believe. When you try to correct it, you get called disinfo agent and get unfriended. A stupid post of FB or Twitter that is an outright lie can get thousands of likes and shares, while a bit of truth is lucky if 5 people share it

So as a tool...  I rate it somewhere near a dull knife. Can still cut but needs a lot of effort

4.  Personal recording ability:  look on Your mobile phone (if it's only a few years old)


The earliest known audio tape recorder was a non-magnetic, non-electric version invented by Alexander Graham Bell's Volta Laboratory and patented in 1886

On 13 August 1931, Duston filed USPTO Patent Application #556,743 for "Method Of And Apparatus For Electrically Recording And Reproducing Sound And Other Vibrations"

I had a portable tape recorder when I was a kid

 ::)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: WarToad on November 08, 2013, 12:55:21 pm
They just upped my power bill to $400.00 a month average now  AARRGGGGG

Holy crap!  My power bill is $130/month.  And that's for 2 adults and 4 kids who are terrible at shutting off lights and TVs.  What kind of lava lamps you have plugged in down there at Casa de Zorgon?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 01:06:37 pm
Matrix, it may be that no One knows what "trying" actually means...  Do We hold Our breath?  Do We stand on Our heads?

How does One learn to "ask the right questions?"  How does this asking take place?  Seems to Me that the mess on this planet that We're in is because We did not know there were questions to be asked, let alone the "right" ones.

So now what?

When we were little babies, before we could Crawl, we had to learn about our immediate environment,
and the workings of our own body, to be able to Learn HOW Crawl...

Most forget this time of great anguish and frustration... One of the reasons for our crying when as a baby.

The next stage was to stand... But everyone forgets WHAT the complexities of the human primate
are in fact to achieve this, let alone the complexities of learning HOW to walk.

Few even recall those days, the reason being, we take walking for granted having learnt !

It was so difficult and frustrating.... we shut out, the thoughts from our memory, we simply don't
wish to remember such difficulties, let alone go there again.   :)



To discover the other End of your mind, is even more difficult but the same type of experiences are involved.
Rather than being of the physical world involves our Return to the Knowledge of LIFE !


This is why it can be found in some ancient writings "We must become as little Children or we cannot enter."

In other words we have to start at like a beginning again and learn as a little child exploring these things.

Normally a little child takes things at face value, without All the B.S.

As adults we have lost this skill, and need to return to the beginning again.

You can't ask anything IF you will NOT know yourselves 1st !

I an Still Learning and will probably never stop Learning even into Eternity.


You know that ancient Phrase "MAN Know thy Self !"


As you Know I am NOT a Religious person and I treat many of the ancient writings
as NOT being religious Writings but simply Inspired thoughts, from The LIFE.

From one such writing refers to statements made by a "builder/carpenter" who was a Nazarene.

Do NOT look upon these words as be being Religious, but rather consider the wisdom
contained in the Inspired words.

It's NOT from the Roman Collection of assorted writings called the bible today...

Usually when the name "Jesus" comes up, the human species goes all silly on it.

Understand It is NOT my intension to preach, or go all religious on you, but merely
to get you to consider these "words of Wisdom", recorded in the ancient writings. 


Quote
3.  Jesus said,
"If those who lead you say to you,
See, The Kingdom is in the sky,
then the birds will precede you.

If they say to you, It is in the sea,
then the fish will precede you.

Rather, The Kingdom is inside you,
and it is outside

When you come to know yourselves,
then you will become known,

and you will realise that it is you
who are the sons of The Living Father.

If you will not know yourselves,
you dwell in poverty
and it is you who are that poverty."

4.  Jesus said,
"The man old in days will not hesitate
to ask a small child seven days old
about the place of Life
,
and he will live.

For many who are first will become last,

and they will become one and the same."

5.   Jesus said,
"Recognise what is in your Sight,
and that which is hidden from you
will become plain to you.

For there is nothing hidden
which will not become Manifest."


When we were little babies.... IF we did NOT Learn about our Body and Environment
we would never have mastered Walking....   :)



So this Phrase applies to this. (Walking)

Quote
If you will not know yourselves,
you dwell in poverty
and it is you who are that poverty."

It also applies to discovering the other End of your Mind !



Now on discovery of your "Real Selves", then you can ask Questions regarding the Place of ALL Knowledge,
which is located at the other End of your "True Mind".... LIFE


So IF you do NOT know your "Real Self", (NOT referring to the flesh)
you can NOT ask anything and dwell in Poverty, and you are that Poverty !

But IF you come to know your "Real Selves", then you can NOW Ask ?


And if you know yourselves you will also know WHAT to ask !

Whatever you "ASK" will be granted but be careful WHAT you ASK as it will Certainly be given to you.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 01:08:36 pm
Energy is your/our Prison !

You can escape from this Prison.

There is another way involving TECHNOLOGY !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: WarToad on November 08, 2013, 01:11:51 pm
I have my own free energy for the upcoming northern winter.  But it involves a chainsaw, splitting maul, and a fireplace.  After a few weeks of harvesting my free energy my arms tell me it wasn't exactly free.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 01:18:40 pm
I have my own free energy for the upcoming northern winter.  But it involves a chainsaw, splitting maul, and a fireplace.  After a few weeks of harvesting my free energy my arms tell me it wasn't exactly free.

LOL Nothing is free in this world !    There is always Cost !
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: WarToad on November 08, 2013, 01:29:00 pm
LOL Nothing is free in this world !    There is always Cost !

Bingo.  There is no such thing as free.  Everything is paid for by the sweat of our brow or the gold in our pocket.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 01:46:54 pm
Bingo.  There is no such thing as free.  Everything is paid for by the sweat of our brow or the gold in our pocket.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy
Quote
In physics, the law of conservation of energy states that the total energy of an isolated system
cannot change—it is said to be conserved over time. Energy can be neither created nor destroyed,
but can change form, for instance chemical energy can be converted to kinetic energy in the explosion
of a stick of dynamite.

A consequence of the law of conservation of energy is that a perpetual motion machine of the first kind
cannot exist. That is to say, no system without an external energy supply can deliver an unlimited amount
of energy to its surroundings.



But we can access the "Libraries", which ALL comes from and with a little Programming,
can obtain all our needs...   :)

Soon on Earth (In the Earth Program) you will know HOW !

And this method is also through TECHNOLOGY !




Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 01:49:56 pm
Unproven yet and unaccessible IF it exists... so it is like giving a radiation detector to a caveman

I say it exists. [shrug] And You (who question its existence) would have no clue whether it's "like giving a radiation detector to a caveman," considering that You don't even know of anything existing.

Maybe it is; maybe it isn't.

Quote
Have been. Yes I said robots are-a-commin... but what I see is a HUGE force of military bots ready to force THEIR paradigm down your throat. They have a head start. THEY are using that tool against us. Can we snatch that tool from them before it's too late?

Well, it's pretty clear that robots are NOT just for military application.  We have them too.  The question is more, "Can We pull the money rug out from under Them before They use THEIR robots on Us?"

Quote
80-90% of what is on the web is total cow puckies... and those listening to the crap have ZERO interest in hearing the truth because it goes against what they WANT to believe. When you try to correct it, you get called disinfo agent and get unfriended. A stupid post of FB or Twitter that is an outright lie can get thousands of likes and shares, while a bit of truth is lucky if 5 people share it

Wholly irrelevant to setting up a central governing site for a solutocracy.

Quote
So as a tool...  I rate it somewhere near a dull knife. Can still cut but needs a lot of effort

Not really for the purposes of a central governing site...

Quote
4.  Personal recording ability:  look on Your mobile phone (if it's only a few years old)


The earliest known audio tape recorder was a non-magnetic, non-electric version invented by Alexander Graham Bell's Volta Laboratory and patented in 1886

On 13 August 1931, Duston filed USPTO Patent Application #556,743 for "Method Of And Apparatus For Electrically Recording And Reproducing Sound And Other Vibrations"

I had a portable tape recorder when I was a kid

 ::)

And that is relevant how?  I am speaking of VIDEO recording mostly, but audio can be of use (Nixon tapes, anyOne?).
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 02:00:20 pm
When we were little babies, before we could Crawl, we had to learn about our immediate environment,
and the workings of our own body, to be able to Learn HOW Crawl...

Most forget this time of great anguish and frustration... One of the reasons for our crying when as a baby.

The next stage was to stand... But everyone forgets WHAT the complexities of the human primate
are in fact to achieve this, let alone the complexities of learning HOW to walk.

Few even recall those days, the reason being, we take walking for granted having learnt !

It was so difficult and frustrating.... we shut out, the thoughts from our memory, we simply don't
wish to remember such difficulties, let alone go there again.   :)



To discover the other End of your mind, is even more difficult but the same type of experiences are involved.
Rather than being of the physical world involves our Return to the Knowledge of LIFE !


This is why it can be found in some ancient writings "We must become as little Children or we cannot enter."

In other words we have to start at like a beginning again and learn as a little child exploring these things.

Normally a little child takes things at face value, without All the B.S.

As adults we have lost this skill, and need to return to the beginning again.

You can't ask anything IF you will NOT know yourselves 1st !

I an Still Learning and will probably never stop Learning even into Eternity.


You know that ancient Phrase "MAN Know thy Self !"


As you Know I am NOT a Religious person and I treat many of the ancient writings
as NOT being religious Writings but simply Inspired thoughts, from The LIFE.

From one such writing refers to statements made by a "builder/carpenter" who was a Nazarene.

Do NOT look upon these words as be being Religious, but rather consider the wisdom
contained in the Inspired words.

It's NOT from the Roman Collection of assorted writings called the bible today...

Usually when the name "Jesus" comes up, the human species goes all silly on it.

Understand It is NOT my intension to preach, or go all religious on you, but merely
to get you to consider these "words of Wisdom", recorded in the ancient writings. 



When we were little babies.... IF we did NOT Learn about our Body and Environment
we would never have mastered Walking....   :)



So this Phrase applies to this. (Walking)

It also applies to discovering the other End of your Mind !



Now on discovery of your "Real Selves", then you can ask Questions regarding the Place of ALL Knowledge,
which is located at the other End of your "True Mind".... LIFE


So IF you do NOT know your "Real Self", (NOT referring to the flesh)
you can NOT ask anything and dwell in Poverty, and you are that Poverty !

But IF you come to know your "Real Selves", then you can NOW Ask ?


And if you know yourselves you will also know WHAT to ask !

Whatever you "ASK" will be granted but be careful WHAT you ASK as it will Certainly be given to you.

What are the STEPS to "know Thyself?" Just saying first One must do that and then One can do another thing does not offer any practical application.  I mean, what if the instruction was to know quantum physics, without any description of what is entailed in that knowing?

You, just go out there and know it.  No, won't tell You to study math and learn about particles.  No, won't even tell You what "particle physics" means.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 08, 2013, 02:23:09 pm
Bingo.  There is no such thing as free.  Everything is paid for by the sweat of our brow or the gold in our pocket.

Not in Vegas   :P  lots of free stuff here  ;D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 02:30:02 pm
Quote
What are the STEPS to "know Thyself?" Just saying first One must do that and then One can do another thing does not offer any practical application.  I mean, what if the instruction was to know quantum physics, without any description of what is entailed in that knowing?

Look it's so simple it is difficult for many to see....   :)

When one has lost something they look for it.

So then we should look for the other End of our "Real Selves". (Involves Sight)

Recognise what is in your Vision !

Quote
You, just go out there and know it.  No, won't tell You to study math and learn about particles.  No, won't even tell You what "particle physics" means.

All Subjects of the Human Primate... Yes that's right Peanuts and Bananas....

So let's step back a moment, and look for our individual "Conscious Origin".

Where the End is, there the beginning is also.    :) 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 02:31:31 pm
Not in Vegas   :P  lots of free stuff here  ;D

Maybe I should change my Flight plans, and go to Vegas instead....   :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 02:36:37 pm
Bingo.  There is no such thing as free.  Everything is paid for by the sweat of our brow or the gold in our pocket.

And that is because We are accounting for the sweat with gold.  Stop accounting for the sweat (Human energy) by adding free energy and robots.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 02:46:03 pm
Look it's so simple it is difficult for many to see....   :)

When one has lost something they look for it.

So then we should look for the other End of our "Real Selves". (Involves Sight)

Recognise what is in your Vision !

Um...  How?

And are blind People SOL?

Quote
All Subjects of the Human Primate... Yes that's right Peanuts and Bananas....

So let's step back a moment, and look for our individual "Conscious Origin".

Where the End is, there the beginning is also.    :)

Well, I can say for Myself personally that I have "journeyed within" and found "source" in becoming everything in infinite directions and dimensions with no dimension at all.  Both in and surrounding the "universe."

I'm pretty sure that might be what You describe.  I find I am doing Consciousness's ("God's") work, in striving to allow bliss for the greatest number.  For bliss (and NOT "work") is the goal.  Now maybe I am in a game that has that as an "end goal," I don't know.

Could not bring back "out here" all I knew "in there."
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 02:49:30 pm
And that is because We are accounting for the sweat with gold.  Stop accounting for the sweat (Human energy) by adding free energy and robots.

When I was Manufacturing back in the 1990's everything was automated but this caused more unemployment !

Automation has been around for years. During the Process of us Manufacturing Computers
for the Automotive Industry there was very little manual work. Most of the manufacturing was Automated.

(Robotics)

It took only minutes to manufacture a Computer consisting of a duel processors. Motorola 68HC11 sing chip micros.


(http://www.happytrees.org/main-images/chip-v2/ic-photo-Motorola--MC68HC11F1CPU4--(HC11-MCU).JPG)


Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 03:10:13 pm
Quote
Um...  How?

And are blind People SOL?

IF you know LIFE  You wouldn't be asking. The Eyes and Brain are only an interface in a 1st person game !

It is only the Mind (LIFE) which sees...   :)

Quote
Well, I can say for Myself personally that I have "journeyed within" and found "source" in becoming everything in infinite directions and dimensions with no dimension at all.  Both in and surrounding the "universe."

I'm pretty sure that might be what You describe.  I find I am doing Consciousness's ("God's") work, in striving to allow bliss for the greatest number.

The LIFE does NOT Need me or you or anyone else to do its work....   :)

If you believe LIFE does, then you are putting yourself above LIFE ?


Quote
For bliss (and NOT "work") is the goal.  Now maybe I am in a game that has that as an "end goal," I don't know.

That is the reasoning of a "Primate" involving "Double Logic"...

Let's step back and view things through LIFE and not the Primate .

YES I experience a Primate too but the way is NOT through a "Primate", but through
the LIGHT or LIFE !

This is nether about "Bliss" or anything else of the Human Primate.

It is about LIFE !

You can demand all you like jump up and down or whatever but it won't change anything outside yourself.

Your experiences have already been "Written" for you by your "Outer" Self i.e The LIGHT.

But then you already know this, and have yet to learn these lessons...   :)

I myself had to learn too.... and still am....  :)


So Come on... return to the LIGHT the gift you were given. You know what I am talking about.

The LIGHT is doing everything for you !

It is NOT the other way around and you know this too.   :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 04:53:59 pm
When I was Manufacturing back in the 1990's everything was automated but this caused more unemployment !

Expected in a scarcity paradigm.  In abundance, all it does is release People who hate, dislike, are bored with, Their jobs to do what They WANT to do.  There is no such thing as "unemployment."

Quote
Automation has been around for years. During the Process of us Manufacturing Computers
for the Automotive Industry there was very little manual work. Most of the manufacturing was Automated.

(Robotics)

It took only minutes to manufacture a Computer consisting of a duel processors. Motorola 68HC11 sing chip micros.


(http://www.happytrees.org/main-images/chip-v2/ic-photo-Motorola--MC68HC11F1CPU4--(HC11-MCU).JPG)

There are things robots can do SO much better.  [smile]  Build THAT by hand in minutes, eh?  [smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 05:13:35 pm
IF you know LIFE  You wouldn't be asking. The Eyes and Brain are only an interface in a 1st person game !

It is only the Mind (LIFE) which sees...   :)

The LIFE does NOT Need me or you or anyone else to do its work....   :)

If you believe LIFE does, then you are putting yourself above LIFE ?

No.  It has never been about  Me but for the multitudes who starve and die.  Guess that's a monkey thing, giving a damn?

Quote
That is the reasoning of a "Primate" involving "Double Logic"...

Let's step back and view things through LIFE and not the Primate .

YES I experience a Primate too but the way is NOT through a "Primate", but through
the LIGHT or LIFE !

This is nether about "Bliss" or anything else of the Human Primate.

It is about LIFE !

You can demand all you like jump up and down or whatever but it won't change anything outside yourself.

Your experiences have already been "Written" for you by your "Outer" Self i.e The LIGHT.

But then you already know this, and have yet to learn these lessons...   :)

I myself had to learn too.... and still am....  :)


So Come on... return to the LIGHT the gift you were given. You know what I am talking about.

The LIGHT is doing everything for you !

It is NOT the other way around and you know this too.   :)

Do I?  I made a very conscious choice to step up with the understanding and ideas I have been gifted with.  It would have been easier not to.

All I know is what little I took from My experience.  Whether there is validity or is monkey, I guess I am not equipped to see.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 06:27:00 pm
Quote
No.  It has never been about  Me but for the multitudes who starve and die.  Guess that's a monkey thing, giving a damn?

I beg to disagree... It is very much about yourself.... As you are showing us, by trying to get others to follow your ideas.

Nothing wrong with that at all !


This is why I no longer try to convince anyone, of anything but purely write what I have found.

I leave it up to others... They can throw it in the trash can... or they might make use of it...   :)

I only write this because I Care !


You did NOT Create this Program, (World) but it was done for you by and for another.


If your Understanding was/is correct, WHY is your World the Way it is?

Don't try and give me that B.S. it was done only by Human Primates...   :(


It has NOT been Created by human Primates, but everything was Created by something else.


Perhaps All of us need to understand WHY ?


As I said it's NOT about the world... but it is about LIFE !


However I do understand where you are coming from, because Once I thought similar....

But since then I have learnt one thing, and that is I have much to learn, so I put my nonsense to one side,
and explored the reasons WHY the human species i.e. the meat suit I am experiencing
is the way it is.

Because all has been made by something else, other than the human primate, which has considerably more knowledge
and understanding than the human primate, WHY has it built in the Suffering and torment we experience?

There is a REASON or it would NOT be this way !

So we can find out WHY or we can Put our heads in the Ground like an  Ostrich ?

(http://thefinanser.co.uk/.a/6a01053620481c970b0168e905c895970c-800wi)


So I went further and was willing to be shown why by The LIGHT or LIFE ?

I soon found I had no knowledge or understanding whatsoever and I found myself in a position
where I would have to re-evaluate my human thinking. In other words put the things I believed to one side,
and approach LIFE and Learn about the WHY !   :)



It is NOT possible for any Human Primate to tell LIFE WHAT is and HOW it should be.

The Species is in total Ignorance, so this is WHY I say WE (includes me of course)
ALL need to start Learning !

We are ALL like little children throwing tantrums... thinking we know better than LIFE instead of taking notice of LIFE.

Perhaps IF we took Notice of LIFE, our experiences would change instead of making the same mistakes year after year.

So in saying this, it is up to us individually, which road we take.


Can I or You convince LIFE of anything or that we know better ?

NO !

Because WE (All of us including myself) are like babies full of Ignorance and nonsense,
and need to grow up and respect the LIFE 1st before the flesh.

I know I will probably be Flamed for what I have written, but I cannot turn away from the Truth !

TRUTH must come 1st, or you/we live in La La Land....   :(

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 06:37:05 pm
Expected in a scarcity paradigm.  In abundance, all it does is release People who hate, dislike, are bored with, Their jobs to do what They WANT to do.  There is no such thing as "unemployment."

There are things robots can do SO much better.  [smile]  Build THAT by hand in minutes, eh?  [smile]

NOT built by hands !  ::)

But through Robotics (Referring to the Computers)   ::)

(http://www.happytrees.org/main-images/chip-v2/ic-photo-Motorola--MC68HC11F1CPU4--(HC11-MCU).JPG)

The above is only a photo of the Single Chip Micro we used in our Computers.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 07:02:24 pm
I am just really curious if anyone else has taken
into thought the amount of hazardous waste that
might be generated by everyone having a handful
of robots...


 Military Hazardous Waste Sickens Land and People


Quote

Worldwide, the military is the most secretive, shielded and privileged of polluters because the hallowed mantra, national security, trumps the public's right to know. Thus, most of the extant data on pollution from US-military-related sites is available solely because of citizen pressure on the Department of Defense (DoD), the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and Congress to inventory, assess, and divulge the extent of the
 
military's environmentally hazardous activities. Citizen awareness and demands for disclosure of military site pollution grew during the 1980's, in the heyday of the new hazardous waste laws, which set standards for storing, transporting, and disposal of solid and hazardous waste as defined in the statutes - namely, the Resource Conservation and Recovery Act (RCRA 1976) and the Comprehensive Environmental Response, Compensation, and Liability Act (CERCLA), which initiated the Superfund program in 1980.
 
By the late 1980's, public data revealed that the Pentagon was generating a ton of toxic waste per minute, more toxic waste than the five largest US chemical companies combined, making it the largest polluter in the United States.  (This figure did not include the Department of Energy's nuclear weapons plants and the Pentagon's civilian contractors.) 
 

http://truth-out.org/news/item/2377:military-hazardous-waste-sickens-land-and-people

How could this possibly be good?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:11:34 pm
I beg to disagree... It is very much about yourself.... As you are showing us, by trying to get others to follow your ideas.

Nothing wrong with that at all !

That is not precisely correct.  All *I*'m trying to do is get People to CONSIDER My ideas.  That They are Mine is irrelevant, though, and over and over I have said if someOne wants to put THEIR name to the ideas, I don't care, as long as they are spread for consideration.

Quote
This is why I no longer try to convince anyone, of anything but purely write what I have found.

I leave it up to others... They can throw it in the trash can... or they might make use of it...   :)

It's not that I am unconvinced, per se.  I just struggle with instructions like, "See," "understand," "return" - when I don't know what I'm looking for or where to see, to understand, or where to go to that is not wherever I AM.

Quote
I only write this because I Care !

I know.  [smile]

Quote
You did NOT Create this Program, (World) but it was done for you by and for another.

If your Understanding was/is correct, WHY is your World the Way it is?

Don't try and give me that B.S. it was done only by Human Primates...   :(

It has NOT been Created by human Primates, but everything was Created by something else.

Not disputing that...  But I ponder being stuck in something not only created by else but FOR else.  What's the point of Me? 

Quote
Perhaps All of us need to understand WHY ?

Would it make a difference if We did?  And that begs the question, Ok then, why?  I seemingly do not understand.

Quote
As I said it's NOT about the world... but it is about LIFE !


However I do understand where you are coming from, because Once I thought similar....

But since then I have learnt one thing, and that is I have much to learn, so I put my nonsense to one side,
and explored the reasons WHY the human species i.e. the meat suit I am experiencing
is the way it is.

I have never assumed I had nothing left to learn...  And I have spent 50+ years trying to figure out why.

Quote
Because all has been made by something else, other than the human primate, which has considerably more knowledge
and understanding than the human primate, WHY has it built in the Suffering and torment we experience?

There is a REASON or it would NOT be this way !

So we can find out WHY or we can Put our heads in the Ground like an  Ostrich ?

(http://thefinanser.co.uk/.a/6a01053620481c970b0168e905c895970c-800wi)


So I went further and was willing to be shown why by The LIGHT or LIFE ?

I soon found I had no knowledge or understanding whatsoever and I found myself in a position
where I would have to re-evaluate my human thinking. In other words put the things I believed to one side,
and approach LIFE and Learn about the WHY !   :)



It is NOT possible for any Human Primate to tell LIFE WHAT is and HOW it should be.

The Species is in total Ignorance, so this is WHY I say WE (includes me of course)
ALL need to start Learning !

We are ALL like little children throwing tantrums... thinking we know better than LIFE instead of taking notice of LIFE.

Perhaps IF we took Notice of LIFE, our experiences would change instead of making the same mistakes year after year.

So in saying this, it is up to us individually, which road we take.


Can I or You convince LIFE of anything or that we know better ?

NO !

Because WE (All of us including myself) are like babies full of Ignorance and nonsense,
and need to grow up and respect the LIFE 1st before the flesh.

I know I will probably be Flamed for what I have written, but I cannot turn away from the Truth !

TRUTH must come 1st, or you/we live in La La Land....   :(

No flame here, but merely frustration for feeling like a blind Human being coaxed with, "Look, it's right there!  Don't You see it?"
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:16:37 pm
NOT built by hands !  ::)

My point, precisely.  As I said, there are things robots can do much better and faster.  And then I said, TRY to build one in minutes by hand, with the implication that such a feat is impossible.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 07:22:12 pm
Also, to consider all of the personal computers, recording
devices, robots etc....

What will happen to those who dont recycle?
Would they be jailed, flogged, punished?

Quote
By 2010, computers and other e-waste accounted for 70% of heavy metals found in landfills in the U.S. A report by the EPA states that e-waste is one of the fastest growing types of waste in the U.S., and the EPA notes that many of those parts being discarded can be reused or recycled.
 
The e-waste in U.S. landfills contains precious metals, glass and plastics, all of which could be reused. Also buried there are pollutants such as lead, cadmium, arsenic, polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs) and mercury.
 
http://greenliving.lovetoknow.com/Computer_Recycling_Statistics
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:24:09 pm
I am just really curious if anyone else has taken
into thought the amount of hazardous waste that
might be generated by everyone having a handful
of robots...


 Military Hazardous Waste Sickens Land and People


http://truth-out.org/news/item/2377:military-hazardous-waste-sickens-land-and-people

How could this possible be good?

I imagine it isn't.  I also imagine that, being more concerned about Human health and happiness that the psychopaths in the military industrial complex, We will find healthy solutions.  Just because We now create such nastiness does not mean it's the ONLY way to do things.

Also, everyOne seems to think robots will be part of everyOne's home.  Not necessarily so.  Only if One WANTS one.  Mostly the robots will be in vital services like food, textiles for clothing, house-building, water provision, and in manufacturing of things like building tools, gardening tools, art supplies, and other such tools as One might need.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:29:20 pm
Also, to consider all of the personal computers, recording
devices, robots etc....

What will happen to those who dont recycle?
Would they be jailed, flogged, punished?
http://greenliving.lovetoknow.com/Computer_Recycling_Statistics

First, We have such waste as We do thanks to planned obsolescence.  Things will last VASTLY longer.  (The amount of waste, in food and materials, will drop to virtually nil.)

Second, all "trash" can be sorted and no One has to "recycle" - at least initially.  I do foresee replicators and "anti-replicators" where the particles are disbursed back into the probabilistic soup of the aether.

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 07:30:52 pm

Also, everyOne seems to think robots will be part of everyOne's home.  Not necessarily so.  Only if One WANTS one.  Mostly the robots will be in vital services like food, textiles for clothing, house-building, water provision, and in manufacturing of things like building tools, gardening tools, art supplies, and other such tools as One might need.

That would still represent a vast increase in industrial waste.

What if one wants several computers, yet does nothing to
recycle the waste? Who would oversee this regulation?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 07:31:07 pm
Quote
My point, precisely.  As I said, there are things robots can do much better and faster.  And then I said, TRY to build one in minutes by hand, with the implication that such a feat is impossible.

My Bad.... I should have looked closer... I apologise...

Laying of Staff who are in need, is NOT easy.... One of my regrets...
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 07:35:40 pm

Second, all "trash" can be sorted and no One has to "recycle" - at least initially.  I do foresee replicators and "anti-replicators" where the particles are disbursed back into the probabilistic soup of the aether.


What if people just throw stuff into the rivers, and lakes?
Like they do now?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 07:35:56 pm
That would still represent a vast increase in industrial waste.

What if one wants several computers, yet does nothing to
recycle the waste? Who would oversee this regulation?

Excellent Point, which poses a serious problem. I know from experience.

You have Brought up a very, very Serious problem, which comes from the Consumer Based Society.

When manufacturing; "Redundancy" is designed into product on purpose... Forcing Sales !

An ugly situation when considering others.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:37:08 pm
That would still represent a vast increase in industrial waste.

What if one wants several computers, yet does nothing to
recycle the waste? Who would oversee this regulation?

Only if We use poor methodologies.  If You want several computers have them.  There is no "regulation" in TAP but the three Laws, and whatever communities agree to live by.

What waste would You have, having two computers?  Presuming they are made the BEST way (no pollution in the process, no planned ob)...

I mean, if one dies, You have a choice:  keep it around or throw it out, right?  You can clutter Your world all You want with dead computers, but if You throw it out, it will be sorted and recycled. 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 07:44:40 pm
When manufacturing; "Redundancy" is designed into product on purpose... Forcing Sales !


Yes, most of us are so acutely aware of those few parts
that are engineered to "fail".   ;D

I suppose a Utopia would give us all computers and robots
that will not break down, or need replacing?

Not sure that is possible, and still only so much
can be done to control those who just feel the
urge to "toss it" out, while on a drive, or by the river,
or the lake, or the seas...

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:50:43 pm
What if people just throw stuff into the rivers, and lakes?
Like they do now?

I imagine They will acquire negative social currency, but regardless, I also imagine We can have retrieval robots.  Maybe?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 07:54:34 pm
Yes, most of us are so acutely aware of those few parts
that are engineered to "fail".   ;D

I suppose a Utopia would give us all computers and robots
that will not break down, or need replacing?

Not sure that is possible, and still only so much
can be done to control those who just feel the
urge to "toss it" out, while on a drive, or by the river,
or the lake, or the seas...

Really wish People would stop calling it a utopia.  It is not.  Just a hell of a lot better than NOW.

Yes, without profit as motive, planned ob will go the way of the dinosaur, and designers with the BEST solutions will win out, and win social currency in the form of appreciation and bragging rights.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 07:58:05 pm
Quote
It's not that I am unconvinced, per se.  I just struggle with instructions like, "See," "understand," "return" -
when I don't know what I'm looking for or where to see, to understand, or where to go to that is not wherever I AM.

Where ever you look you will find the Processing System Right in front of You over your whole Vision.

I know this will sound a little weird but find a well lit White Wall or something and stare at it.
Now blink your eyelids Rapidly while staring at the wall without moving your eyes.

What I call the "Eye Matrix" will appear stretched out over your whole Vision.

Looks like This...

(http://www.thelivingmoon.com/48matrix_traveller/images/0057.jpg)

So it is NOT far from anyone of us....   :)

The Blue Octagons appear Quite Large. I will give more detail on this when I get a moment.

It won't be easy to see but it can be seen (In Full Colour on a White Back Ground)

The other way to see this is to look at Light being Strobed on a Wall.. (Disco Strobe)

Sorry I am a little tied up at present as I am off to China tomorrow...  :(


As I will be travelling all over the place in China for the next few weeks, Communication on the net.
is NOT going to be Easy.

So if you can get a whole bunch of questions for me, I will order them and take the time to address them for you.
Even if it involves Hours.

Remember we are a family in Pegasus...   :)

As soon as I can get on the net again in China (Lunch times etc.) I will come back to your Concerns...


But I can say for Now, I went through all these issues Like you over many years.

So I can explain what I found.


I don't want anyone to follow me or what I can show, but if it gives understanding in the end then
some may put it to use.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 08:01:09 pm
Yes, most of us are so acutely aware of those few parts
that are engineered to "fail".   ;D

I suppose a Utopia would give us all computers and robots
that will not break down, or need replacing?

Not sure that is possible, and still only so much
can be done to control those who just feel the
urge to "toss it" out, while on a drive, or by the river,
or the lake, or the seas...

Yes your concerns are very very, real and a huge problem, we still have to find practical answers for,
or we will be Living in a rubbish dump, as some do in other 2nd & 3rd world countries.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 08, 2013, 08:01:18 pm
Enjoy Your time in China!  I appreciate Your willingness to explain and try to impart understanding.

I'll see what I see on a wall!  [smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 08:01:53 pm
I imagine They will acquire negative social currency

How would this be tracked, and controlled?

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: burntheships on November 08, 2013, 08:09:08 pm

or we will be Living in a rubbish dump, as some do in other 2nd & 3rd world countries.

Matrix, a very real concern it is....

Do take care while your away,
hope you have carefree travels.

 :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: rdunk on November 08, 2013, 08:55:10 pm
As you know, my thinking is in an opposite direction to what is in "the plan", so just listen to what I say with a "grain of salt". :) There is something going on today, to the which I see similarities in thought, ideals, and political ideology.  And I will try to relate that here!

TAP & OBAMACARE~~~~~~~~~~~~!!!

Both of these are made up plans that are intended to directly interfere with peoples lives, on a presumed/stated basis that  "THIS IS GOING TO MAKE THINGS BETTER FOR EVERYBODY". it is like "to hell with the torpedos, and full steam ahead". Of course, these two programs are at opposite ends of the spectrum, as TAP envisions "no government", and Obamacare is specifically intended for government to "take complete control" of the people (unstated but obvious intention).

But the extreme difference noted aside, TAP and Obamacare are hand in hand relative to the long-term up-hill battle to be faced. I am not going into the politics of the good and bad for our country, but for sure there are specifics that will doom such actions - - primarily for America, if the people are not for it, and on board, 'IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN", at least not for long!! Obamacare has happened, but it is even now on its beginnings of life support", with resuscitation implemented, even though DNR (do not resuscitate) will be an eventual determination. One of the saddest things, just the program software & etc has already cost $100's of millions of dollars of increase to our debt, and they are pretty much starting over.

And Obamacare doesn't hold a candle to the extreme interference to peoples lives TAP would involve. Sure, promises to any living animal can bring some positive results, especially free this and free that, and live like you want to. Dogs and cats like to be fed too! But, if the food doesn't come, they get upset pretty quick.

There is no way Obamacare will be a serious success, because there is nothing good about it- NONE in the end. The people are seeing that, and are beginning to rise up against it. The voting this time next year will show that directly.

Obamacare should be some amount of learning experience for anyone seriously considering TAP, for anything other than a collective based work farm, or some such-like - - maybe on an island somewhere, where there is no government, no energy, and if people eat, they have to work for it. A system that is a "free lunch" for everybody won't work, because there will be no food to eat, until the people work to get it!

That is more said than I intended - the thought is, to use Obamacare as learning relative to TAP!
 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 08, 2013, 09:58:15 pm
Thank you All; I will do my very best to get on the Net where and when I can in China.

I'm also off to Lhasa so I hope to get photos of both China and Lhasa...

My thoughts will be with you all.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 08, 2013, 11:14:26 pm
I look forward to seeing some pics matrix
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Angel_Mass on November 09, 2013, 12:17:20 am
Thank you All; I will do my very best to get on the Net where and when I can in China.

I'm also off to Lhasa so I hope to get photos of both China and Lhasa...

My thoughts will be with you all.

Have a wonderful experience and time in China! Take care my friend.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 09, 2013, 01:20:02 am
Thank you Angel my dear friend.

I hope to have a few photos (Many) to upload on Pegasus, to show what I have been up to in China.

Off now to get some sleep.

I see a "typhoon" is about to hit the South of China on Sunday, (where the same typhoon did a lot of damage
in the Philippines) the area I am going to 1st...

So hope it doesn't cause my flight to be cancelled or be reschedule.  [worried]

We fly between the Philippines and the east cost of China before landing at Guangzhou
so hope I don't get a rough flight.

Wings are for the birds....   :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: The Matrix Traveller on November 09, 2013, 01:25:03 am
I look forward to seeing some pics matrix

I hope to get a few hundred especially in Lhasa.... and some other places around Xi'an (pyramids etc.)
and Beijing.

I also hope to show a lot of geometry displayed in ancient buildings etc.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 09, 2013, 05:16:40 am
What if people just throw stuff into the rivers, and lakes?
Like they do now?

Say it ain't so  :P

(http://bigblueorb.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/kids-swim-trash.jpg)

And I don't give a rats ass about how poor they are... there is NO EXCUSE to toss your trash into your own drinking water

 ::)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: robomont on November 09, 2013, 05:25:45 am
Somebody through away a perfectly good kid?
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 09, 2013, 05:28:37 am
What will happen to those who dont recycle?
Would they be jailed, flogged, punished?

FLOGGED... works for me :P


So under Abundance... can I please has 100 pounds of gold?  I need it
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Sinny on November 09, 2013, 05:42:33 am
FLOGGED... works for me :P


So under Abundance... can I please has 100 pounds of gold?  I need it

Only if you supply me with one bacon sandwich everyday for the next 3650 days...  :D
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 09, 2013, 09:03:36 am
How would this be tracked, and controlled?

It won't be - but if YOU know someOne is doing this, You can spread the word.  REPUTATION is One's "coin" in abundance.

No "tracking" at all except of products and requests so as to provide for supply and demand.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 09, 2013, 09:24:54 am
As you know, my thinking is in an opposite direction to what is in "the plan", so just listen to what I say with a "grain of salt". :) There is something going on today, to the which I see similarities in thought, ideals, and political ideology.  And I will try to relate that here!

TAP & OBAMACARE~~~~~~~~~~~~!!!

Both of these are made up plans that are intended to directly interfere with peoples lives, on a presumed/stated basis that  "THIS IS GOING TO MAKE THINGS BETTER FOR EVERYBODY". it is like "to hell with the torpedos, and full steam ahead". Of course, these two programs are at opposite ends of the spectrum, as TAP envisions "no government", and Obamacare is specifically intended for government to "take complete control" of the people (unstated but obvious intention).

And also:  Obamacare is designed to further crush the middle class.  It is motivated by money/power.  It FORCES People do do things.  In TAP, no One is FORCED to do anything, and can continue as now.  They may CHOOSE to make changes - from hauling Their tail ends out of jobs that They dislike, hate, or are bored with to doing what They LOVE to do.

I find it disturbing that You are comparing Ocare to TAP.  You CLEARLY do not understand TAP.

Quote
But the extreme difference noted aside, TAP and Obamacare are hand in hand relative to the long-term up-hill battle to be faced. I am not going into the politics of the good and bad for our country, but for sure there are specifics that will doom such actions - - primarily for America, if the people are not for it, and on board, 'IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN", at least not for long!! Obamacare has happened, but it is even now on its beginnings of life support", with resuscitation implemented, even though DNR (do not resuscitate) will be an eventual determination. One of the saddest things, just the program software & etc has already cost $100's of millions of dollars of increase to our debt, and they are pretty much starting over.

Oh, I agree that TAP will not happen unless We CHOOSE it.  My guess is that if statistically all of Us are aware of the freedom from totalitarianism (which Ocare is just one program to promote towards that goal), freedom from HAVING to do robotic work as a cog in the system, from the frustration of not having what it takes to pursue One's gifts, most will choose TAP.

Quote
And Obamacare doesn't hold a candle to the extreme interference to peoples lives TAP would involve. Sure, promises to any living animal can bring some positive results, especially free this and free that, and live like you want to. Dogs and cats like to be fed too! But, if the food doesn't come, they get upset pretty quick.

Just what "interference" do You see in:  "Sure, keep doing what You're doing if You love it.  If You WANT a change, here are options You never had before."

Quote
There is no way Obamacare will be a serious success, because there is nothing good about it- NONE in the end. The people are seeing that, and are beginning to rise up against it. The voting this time next year will show that directly.

Oh, any such devious move will be seen through eventually.

Quote
Obamacare should be some amount of learning experience for anyone seriously considering TAP, for anything other than a collective based work farm, or some such-like - - maybe on an island somewhere, where there is no government, no energy, and if people eat, they have to work for it. A system that is a "free lunch" for everybody won't work, because there will be no food to eat, until the people work to get it!

Huh?  I really did not grasp that at all.  Can You rephrase.  What has islands with no energy got to do with casting off all robotic work in favor of contributing in ways One LOVES to do?

Quote
That is more said than I intended - the thought is, to use Obamacare as learning relative to TAP!

That is like using slavery to learn how to dance.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 09, 2013, 09:29:58 am
FLOGGED... works for me :P

Yes, violence solves everything.   ::)

Quote
So under Abundance... can I please has 100 pounds of gold?  I need it

Conceivably.  It will merely be pretty and useful metal in abundance, and good probability You can get some from someOne.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 09, 2013, 12:07:37 pm
Conceivably.  It will merely be pretty and useful metal in abundance, and good probability You can get some from someOne.

Actually gold will be in rare supply... with all those robot armies using it iy will soon run out :D

As to all those sccap computers... send em to me  I will deal with them :D (and then I will have my GOLD hehehe)

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 09:30:14 am
Actually gold will be in rare supply... with all those robot armies using it iy will soon run out :D

As to all those sccap computers... send em to me  I will deal with them :D (and then I will have my GOLD hehehe)

I'm betting We can work around that (recycling, as You say, using different materials, whatever) until We get transmutation up and running, or until We get replicators.  Either way, We will not be wanting for gold.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 11:22:59 am
Aliens are probably not on pause! Rather I think it strongly possible they may have just quit! Of course we all know they pick up on every piece of communication on this planet, and when they began to hear all of the communication about implementing Obamacare and TAP, they simply decided they wanted no part in it. And, of course that is what we should expect from a "more intelligent race" anyway!!!  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Geez, rdunk.  What is with You and TAP?  You favor the way things are set up now where the bulk of Humanity is:

1.  Starving, and/or
2.  Adding Human energy in robotic jobs They hate and/or
3.  Cannot follow Their heart in creating

?

And if Your heart is being followed now (few of Us), You can keep on keeping on.

Again, You CLEARLY do not grasp TAP.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: rdunk on November 10, 2013, 11:59:33 am
Geez, rdunk.  What is with You and TAP?  You favor the way things are set up now where the bulk of Humanity is:....................

Quite frankly Amaterasu, and should be no surprise, IMO TAP is a fairy tale pipe dream that is not workable, and will never happen on this Planet. The make-up of humans, along with whatever spiritual forces you may or may not think play a role, this dream world of TAP that has been conjured up with all of the what if's and's and but's, is a waste of yours and everybody's time. Here again (The Plan post), we have another umpteen pages of the same back and forth on TAP that we had on the each of ALL of the past similar posts.

I understand you have view about things, but I and for sure, and likely most people on this palnet, do not share your view, about how to "fix" whatever things need to be fixed.

I would suggest that if you are mindful about fixing the world, then you might should narrow your focus to TRYING to address and fix one little problem at a time, in your house or town first. When the problems are fixed there, then you could expand your focus to maybe county wide. You never know, doing so, you might actually make a positive contribution to your community.  The feeling of personal achievement can be found in actually helping people, more so, than talking about what people might, could've should've would've !!!

There are probably a lot of things you can do to help make things better for people around you! But just talking about helping people is not ever going to cause anything to change!

As I said, IMO! :)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 12:11:12 pm
Geez, rdunk.  What is with You and TAP?  You favor the way things are set up now where the bulk of Humanity is:....................

Quite frankly Amaterasu, and should be no surprise, IMO TAP is a fairy tale pipe dream that is not workable, and will never happen on this Planet. The make-up of humans, along with whatever spiritual forces you may or may not think play a role, this dream world of TAP that has been conjured up with all of the what if's and's and but's, is a waste of yours and everybody's time. Here again (The Plan post), we have another umpteen pages of the same back and forth on TAP that we had on the each of ALL of the past similar posts.

I understand you have view about things, but I and for sure, and likely most people on this palnet, do not share your view, about how to "fix" whatever things need to be fixed.

I would suggest that if you are mindful about fixing the world, then you might should narrow your focus to TRYING to address and fix one little problem at a time, in your house or town first. When the problems are fixed there, then you could expand your focus to maybe county wide. You never know, doing so, you might actually make a positive contribution to your community.  The feeling of personal achievement can be found in actually helping people, more so, than talking about what people might, could've should've would've !!!

There are probably a lot of things you can do to help make things better for people around you! But just talking about helping people is not ever going to cause anything to change!

As I said, IMO! :)

There IS NO SOLUTION to poverty and war and oppression and profiteering that also contains money.  For a while, the issues might be pressed back, but they WILL encroach again - ALL money systems promote and give power to the psychopaths.

"Focusing on one problem" is the waste of energy.  It will not be solved in a money system, in a hierarchical system where the rich live richly and the vast majority are dying, living no life, forced into the robot jobs and non-productive trappings (banking, insurance, advertising, accounting, sales, cashiering, etc.) which are MOST of what Human energy is used for with the ONLY goal being the further enrichment of the already extremely wealthy.

So I will accept that You are incapable of grasping and will only ask that You quit making comments about which You have little understanding.

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: rdunk on November 10, 2013, 01:20:10 pm
So I will accept that You are incapable of grasping and will only ask that You quit making comments about which You have little understanding.

And I would suggest that you post your TAP stuff in your dedicated forum area, with people who possibly are with you on the TAP pipe dream! I, and likely others, certainly don't go THERE to comment!! I would assume that was the reason for your forum board, to give you a dedicated podium from which to "teach" your religion of TAP! If it is not already blocked, I would bet you could have your board "blocked" from the "recent posts", so no dissenters would even know about your board posts???

 
http://www.thelivingmoon.com/forum/index.php?board=163.0
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 02:20:49 pm
And I would presume derogatory comments made outside that area are fair game to address.  [smile]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 10, 2013, 04:40:41 pm
Amy, in the world of free energy will we still use the energy we use now. For example, it is very difficult to power a 747 with batteries or a submarine with solar power. Launch a rocket with electricity?  Some items require so much power that electricity that i know of, falls short.
For a long time all the sailors of the world used the free energy of the sun that creates wind to power their boats. It is a proven tech that no one wants because it is too slow. We either have to go back to using less power or take such a huge step to using what ever we want. I say, I would turn into an "electric hog" overnight and I don't yet know if it would change me for the better.
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 04:54:03 pm
Amy, in the world of free energy will we still use the energy we use now. For example, it is very difficult to power a 747 with batteries or a submarine with solar power. Launch a rocket with electricity?  Some items require so much power that electricity that i know of, falls short.
For a long time all the sailors of the world used the free energy of the sun that creates wind to power their boats. It is a proven tech that no one wants because it is too slow. We either have to go back to using less power or take such a huge step to using what ever we want. I say, I would turn into an "electric hog" overnight and I don't yet know if it would change me for the better.
Deuem

I don't see why not - but that We can fly with electrogravitics (witness the B2), and power subs, and power whatever else We might want to power.  And I suppose if You choose to behave in any given way, and You are dissatisfied with You, You can make better choices.

Seriously, I do NOT grasp the idea that We should not move to better the planet for the BILLIONS who do not have enough to eat, because We might choose poorly.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 10, 2013, 05:36:38 pm
We can fly with electrogravitics (witness the B2),

Um we do? since when does the B2 fly with electrogravitics?

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 10, 2013, 05:54:39 pm
Starving Biafrans...

Lets have a look at an example that has nothing to do with money really , just an attempt to address a problem


India and Republic of Biafra  Two countries that had a ood scarcity and couldn't feed their people...

Enter CANADA, in this case the Canadian Wheat Board.

Canada had developed a strain of wheat that was hardy and easy to grow. A hybrid long before we heard the term GMO...

So Canada, wanting to share this abundance :P sent forth agricultural  emissaries on a mission to help solve the worlds hunger issues... quite noble of them :D

India... these emissaries showed Indian farmers how to grow food properly (farming methods that kept the soil fertile for generations) and gave them FREE seed to start the crops using this tough hybrid wheat.

India paid attention, did what they were taught and within a few short years were producing TONS of wheat... in fact so much wheat that they has lots extra to spare and started exporting it.

Well back in Canada this caused a serious problem, because the wheat Canadian farmers were growing had no market so it filled up the silos, filled up the train cars and rotted

Canada government now had to help their own farmers that were now without a place to get rid of their wheat and keep the farm

Republic of Biafra

Biafra is that place where they always show you those half dead starving kids on Christian charity programs asking for money...

The same Canadian  Emissaries went to Biafra... taught the same farming methods, gave the free seeds...  but the farmers of Biafra were a stubborn lot.

They told the Emissaries that this is not the way our ancestors farmed... so GO HOME... and they went back to farming the dust like their ancestors have always done... and went back to starving

Things are not always as simple to fix as we would like them to be :D

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 10, 2013, 06:37:51 pm
Um we do? since when does the B2 fly with electrogravitics?

I was just going to ask the same question. there is a possibility that some are rigged with special surfaces to make them slip through the air faster but I have never heard of one powered by EG.
 
If you follow Mother nature, the billions of animals that have no food to eat become the food for others. Maybe we should start eating people, Hey free energy!  :o   many animals eat their own just to get that energy back...hum, Solient Green anyone?
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 06:40:58 pm
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_flyingobjects44.htm

http://www.forbiddenknowledgetv.com/videos/suppressed-technology/b2-bomber-and-electrogravitics-declassified.html

http://www.integrityresearchinstitute.org/electrogravitics.html

http://www.angelfire.com/scifi/EclipseLab/2k1/angel/angel.html

http://www.stealthskater.com/Documents/Ventura_03.pdf

http://www.blue-science.org/articles/2013/09/29/interview-with-matt-pulver-subquantum-kinetics-godels-theorem-and-electrogravitics/

http://www.examiner.com/article/b2-bomer-may-have-electrogavitic-feature

http://stuffucanuse.com/topics/Anti_gravity.htm

http://engines.fighter-planes.com/jet_engine.htm

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/01/28/1043534050248.html

http://www.ultraclearance.com/test/?page_id=30

From:  http://www.earthrainbownetwork.com/BigLieKosovo.htm

Quote
(NOTE: IF YOU ARE CURIOUS TO KNOW MORE ABOUT THIS ANTIGRAVITY TECHNOLOGY, GO AT
Mr. Boylan's webpage at http://www.ufonetwork.com/boylan/articles.html AND CHECK THE LINK WITH "Antigravity Drives" IN IT.)

Here is a relevant quote from another of Mr. Boylan Internet published
documents:

Colonel Donald Ware, USAF (ret.) told me that he recently learned from a
three-star General that the X-33 has electrogravitics (antigravity) system
on board, [as the unacknowledged military version I estimate exists must
surely also have.] This antigravity electrogravitics system has already
been operationally proven on the B-2 Stealth bomber, which Colonel Ware has
revealed also has electrogravitics system on board.

The late Colonel Steve Wilson, USAF (ret.), Skywatch's founder, stated that
military astronauts trained at a secret aerospace academy separate from the
regular Air Force Academy at Colorado Springs, Co. These military
astronauts operate out of Beale and Vandenberg Air Force Bases, Northern
California From those bases, these military astronauts regularly fly
trans-atmospherically and into space. One of the aerospace craft they use,
Colonel Wilson reported, is the X-33A, a two-man antigravity discoid ship.
Whether they also fly the Aurora and the military version of the X-33A
spaceplane has not been confirmed, but likely.

1998 Dr. Richard J. Boylan

And a cute li'l vid.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEe0N5h95fk[/youtube]


Just sayin'.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 06:46:04 pm
If you follow Mother nature, the billions of animals that have no food to eat become the food for others. Maybe we should start eating people, Hey free energy!  :o   many animals eat their own just to get that energy back...hum, Solient Green anyone?
 
Deuem

Given that We already over-produce food on this planet by about 25% but throw out nearly half of it due to spoilage, I think We're set on food.  And We only throw out food because We distribute by PROFIT and not NEED.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 10, 2013, 07:01:53 pm
And We only throw out food because We distribute by PROFIT and not NEED.

The majority of food that is tossed out is because it has limited shelf life. We over produce it because we know there is spoilage. While you can airlift sacks of grain to needy areas, transporting most produce is a logistics impossibility :D

But the thing is if WE can produce this over abundance that we throw away to the pigs... why cannot the other nations do the same?

WHY should we feel obligated to provide free food for people who literally REFUSE to help themselves and then when we do feed them, all they do is bread more mouths to feed next year, thereby just continuing the cycle?

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 10, 2013, 07:06:22 pm
until We get transmutation up and running, or until We get replicators.  Either way, We will not be wanting for gold.

Well if your waiting for transmutation or replicators to make TAP viable... you are going to have to wait a very long time :D

I suppose we could mine gold from asteroids :D But other materials that will work? they are all more rare than gold :P
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 10, 2013, 07:10:52 pm

I was just going to ask the same question. there is a possibility that some are rigged with special surfaces to make them slip through the air faster but I have never heard of one powered by EG.

Yes plasma energization of the skin... slip through the air, hide from view and radar, but that is NOT EG. And it has already been released by Northrop Gruman (and JLN labs showed us how it was done years ago
 
Quote
If you follow Mother nature, the billions of animals that have no food to eat become the food for others. Maybe we should start eating people, Hey free energy!  :o   many animals eat their own just to get that energy back...hum, Solient Green anyone?

The TRUE ALIEN AGENDA....

(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/p75x225/1461554_10151778590887104_1288671242_n.jpg)

(https://scontent-b-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/s261x260/1424498_10151778557462104_852315442_n.jpg)
 
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 10, 2013, 07:13:44 pm
Quote
And We only throw out food because We distribute by PROFIT and not NEED.

If this is true then why are the farmers the lowest on the money scale, they should be the rich guys on the block.  Sorry, I don't see that here. Every farmer I have ever heard says they are on the limits of going broke. there is no profit in growing food.  Very few make above the wages city folk get.
 
Deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 07:27:28 pm
The majority of food that is tossed out is because it has limited shelf life. We over produce it because we know there is spoilage. While you can airlift sacks of grain to needy areas, transporting most produce is a logistics impossibility :D

But the thing is if WE can produce this over abundance that we throw away to the pigs... why cannot the other nations do the same?

WHY should we feel obligated to provide free food for people who literally REFUSE to help themselves and then when we do feed them, all they do is bread more mouths to feed next year, thereby just continuing the cycle?

We, being the planet, produce more food than all of Us could eat.  And yes, it sits in stores while People outside starve, watching while it spoils.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 07:29:06 pm

If this is true then why are the farmers the lowest on the money scale, they should be the rich guys on the block.  Sorry, I don't see that here. Every farmer I have ever heard says they are on the limits of going broke. there is no profit in growing food.  Very few make above the wages city folk get.
 
Deuem

The farmers sell to the stores who mark it up radically.  The farmers are NOT the Ones making money.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 07:35:48 pm
Well if your waiting for transmutation or replicators to make TAP viable... you are going to have to wait a very long time :D

I suppose we could mine gold from asteroids :D But other materials that will work? they are all more rare than gold :P

Please read that again.  Please.  WHERE did I say I was waiting for those?  Do point it out.  I said:

I'm betting We can work around that (recycling, as You say, using different materials, whatever) until We get transmutation up and running, or until We get replicators.  Either way, We will not be wanting for gold.

EDIT to add:  Also...  There is stuff here on Peggy pointing to replicators on the way.  So...  You don't KNOW that it will be a long time.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 10, 2013, 08:18:37 pm
Quote
The farmers sell to the stores who mark it up radically.  The farmers are NOT the Ones making money.

I'm sorry, we don't have that many stores that sell these goods. Mostly farmers famlies in markets or street side. The stores are for imported food mostly...Imported from other countries or other areas of China. So the price I see is a farmers price and that price is kept down by the buyers. They want their food and don't want to pay for it. The moment any farmer here can get a job or sell their land they stop farming. Your robots will be busy in the fields. Start them there first, growing food. Food is more important than free electricity any day....
 
Real farming is very hard work and no one wants to pick weeds all day. Work in the hot sun and burn off your skin, carry water to the plants. It is very hard too do. And worst of all they get below minimum wage to do it. Without farmers everything stops instantly........
 
deuem
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: zorgon on November 10, 2013, 10:30:22 pm
Just sayin'.

Smoke and mirrors... ;)
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 10, 2013, 11:58:51 pm
Ya. Sure. Y'betchy. By golly.  [grin]
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 11, 2013, 12:06:09 am
Real farming is very hard work and no one wants to pick weeds all day. Work in the hot sun and burn off your skin, carry water to the plants. It is very hard too do. And worst of all they get below minimum wage to do it. Without farmers everything stops instantly........
 
deuem

I'm envisioning small robots in teams...like scrubbing bubbles only farm robots that scurry over the land, digging, planting, weeding, removing insects, harvesting, with no need for pesticides or herbicides, all organically grown, and tucking the produce onto robotic transport for shipment to a central place where orders are filled automatically from online requests.  (With Those who LOVE to farm able to claim what land They WANT to farm and robots moving out of the way.)

Also, vertical farms produce VASTLY more food per acre, and would be VERY easy to roboticize.

Yes, the system now requires labor that may suit some, but not most.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: deuem on November 11, 2013, 12:50:39 am
that is the kind of Amy I want to read, You just gave me something to sink my teeth into. A goal,,,,,
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Amaterasu on November 11, 2013, 08:53:53 am
that is the kind of Amy I want to read, You just gave me something to sink my teeth into. A goal,,,,,

[smile]  Yes, like I said, add robots where there are not enough People who WANT to add Their energy to do necessary things.

I envision a lot, BUT I will not say that HAS to be the way it goes.  All I would provide is the framework.  I figure since 96% of Humans are NOT psychopathic, They will build well upon that framework.
Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: Somamech on November 11, 2013, 10:14:11 am

If this is true then why are the farmers the lowest on the money scale, they should be the rich guys on the block.  Sorry, I don't see that here. Every farmer I have ever heard says they are on the limits of going broke. there is no profit in growing food.  Very few make above the wages city folk get.
 
Deuem

That my friend is an interesting point and one that has not been hit on CT boards, TruthSeeking/Distraction Boards or Organic Farming Hangouts!

Although making a buck in the markets I am interested in differ greatly from the market's you mention, same rule applys.

Once again I point to ABC TV Australia, and in this case I take you all on a journey to the Commodities report:

http://www.abc.net.au/landline/content/2013/s3887646.htm

I prefer this show these day's to gardening shows for the most part as one can watch how Food work's.  I don't agree with some of the Farmer's in the program thats for sure, but in saying so understanding a problem and in some case's a lack of a problem has to be paramount to understanding how the foodchain works. 




   

Title: Re: The Plan
Post by: PLAYSWITHMACHINES on November 11, 2013, 03:38:44 pm
Well if i look at history, especially the local museums i see that farmers became the land owners & thereby became very wealthy indeed.....

This happened because of the 'coming together' of local groups who each had an allotment, these groups became the farming families of the 1700's who became the rich folk of today....... ::)

ETA: Unless you look at farmers in Texas who struck OIL, which is far more profit than farming... ::)