Author Topic: 562 comet in erased history  (Read 2958 times)

Offline ArMaP

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #15 on: June 05, 2015, 05:50:47 PM »
That's what I thought, if there was some "destruction from the sky" on an area that was not under Christian rule wouldn't it be natural for the Catholic Church to use that as a sign that they should convert, instead of hiding it?

PS: I don't know if any of those links has some explanation, I didn't follow any of them. :)

space otter

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #16 on: June 05, 2015, 06:30:17 PM »

PS: I don't know if any of those links has some explanation, I didn't follow any of them. :)

neither did any one else it seems

well I have found that it is fascinating that folks have such strong opinions before doing any reading on a subject ..especially when references are provided
they just shout out stuff

the following is not in any particular order.. just fleshing out some info as I go

I am sooooooo sorry ....for those of you who may find the facts (if you ever managed to read any of this) get in the way of your voices
not that lack of info seems to stopped anyone so far ....sigh


History of Britain Suppressed Part 8 - Comet in 562AD

Published on Aug 18, 2013
Alan Wilson discusses his latest book "The Invisible Kingdom of Britain" specifically the Comet that devastated Britain and Bolivia in AD562

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Bolivia in AD562

The Saxon invaders were the barbarous savages of these lands, not the original free peoples of Britain, whose religion was very similar to the Holy Science of the Heavens, more recently known as Astrotheology, which took for its foundation the fundamental and absolute truth of the Soul’s divine and immortal nature.

When the Saxons settled in Kent upon the invitation of infamous and allegedly incestuous King Vortigern, who was accused of being a usurper of the throne in the writings of St. Glidas, they brought with them barbarism, debauchery and a literal interpretation of the allegories of the Holy Science, which had been used for thousands of years by indigenous elders to convey the science of astrotheology to their students, which happened in every corner of the globe during more enlightened ages of the Grand Cycle of the Precession of the Equinoxes.

The Saturnic/Satanic credo of ignorance was imposed upon the Britons in the name of the Christian Church of Rome, under a Babylonic system of control administered through taxation, the control of information and pseudo-religious inquisition, savagely enforced by the Germanic tribes at the behest of the Holy Roman Emperors, in order to obliterate the inherent spirituality of the millions who fearlessly sacrificed their lives in the name of the unalienable freedom that they knew to be the birthright, whether for the sake of their children, their nation and its future generations, or in the name of the Supreme Being at the centre of the Universe, manifested as matter in the form of Christos or Christ the Sun.

Despite much of what is claimed in the woefully inaccurate Anglo-Saxon Chronicles, the primary evidence suggests that the Saxons would never have conquered these islands by five centuries of pope-sponsored genocide, followed by another thousand years of feudal tyranny, perpetual war and mind-boggling deception, were it not for the celestial phenomenon that was described by those who witnessed it from the shores of Brittany as resembling a fire-breathing red dragon which lit up the skies for eleven days without any night. The brilliant works of Alan Wilson and Baram Blacket, as well as Grant Berkley, have documented almost all of the surviving material evidence that this cosmic catastrophe took place.

“For the fire of vengeance, justly kindled by former crimes, spread from sea from sea, fed by the hands of our foes in the east, and did not cease, until, destroying the neighboring towns and lands, it reached the other side of the island, and dipped its red and savage tongue in the western ocean.”

De Excidio Brittaniae et Conquestu by St. Gildas the Wise.

Along with the millions who perished in a blast that reduced to ash all living matter in its path, an estimated two million more Britons were slaughtered by the Germanic tribes, from around 570 AD until the death of William the Bastard at the end of the 11th century, when he is reputed to have confessed on his deathbed that he was commissioned by the Church of Rome to carry out a genocide against the remaining indigenous peoples of Britain, which he admitted to have done without mercy or compassion or justification. This, the pretender to the throne who stole the land from the people and distributed grants of that which he had no valid claim to those who were loyal to his cause, with 25% going to his sponsors in Rome, as documented by the aptly titled Doomsday Book.

Were it not for the legal repudiation of ecclesiastical law and the supremacy of the pope in subsequently enacted British constitutional documents , as well as the rise of the British Empire, the House of Rothschild and its total dominion over almost all financial, political, social and cultural concerns, the Jesuits might have held on to control of the entire planet, rather than sharing it with Lord Rothschild and the reigning British pretender to the throne.




Published on Apr 29, 2012

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19 February, 2014 - 12:24 johnblack
Why is the global climatic cataclysm of the sixth century virtually unheard of?
There was a sign from the sun, the like of which had never been seen and reported before. The sun became dark and its darkness lasted for 18 months.  Each day, it shone for about four hours, and still this light was only a feeble shadow.  Everyone declared that the sun would never recover its full light again.
Historiae Ecclesiasticae

Between the years 535 and 536, a series of major global climatic events that took place that could easily be described as a global cataclysm with catastrophic consequences. The above abstract is from the sixth century historian and church leader, John of Ephesus, in his historical work, Church Histories (‘Historiae Ecclesiasticae’).

John of Ephesus is not the only one that mentions this event. Procopius lived between 500 and 565 AD and he was a late antiquities scholar and one of the main historians of the 6th century. He also refers to the strange behaviour of the sun and believed that it was a bad sign and the beginning of other events.

… during this year a most dread portent took place. For the sun gave forth its light without brightness...and it seemed exceedingly like the sun in eclipse, for the beams it shed were not clear.,
History of the Wars: The Vandalic War.

And we have yet another reference from the sixth century writer, Zacharias of Mytilene, who authored a chronicle that contains a section referring to the ‘Dark Sun’ for the period of 535/536 AD.

The sun began to be darkened by day and the moon by night, while the ocean was tumultuous with spray from the 24th of March in this year till the 24th of June in the following year... And, as the winter was a severe one, so much so that from the large and unwonted quantity of snow the birds perished... there was distress... among men... from the evil things,
Zacharias of Mytilene (Chronicle, 9.19, 10.1)

These three extracts are just a representative sample of numerous accounts from all over the world, written in the same period of time. In all cases, the sun was described as getting dimmer and losing its light. Many also described it as having a bluish colour. The effects were also observed with the moon – it wasn’t as bright anymore. The reduction of the light resulted in the reduction of heat on the planet; no rain and a very long winter resulted in crop failures and for birds and other wildlife to perish, as Zacharias of Mytilene writes. Famine and plagues struck many areas and there were a huge number of deaths.

In China and Japan, the event was also recorded in great detail. Massive droughts and thousands of deaths. The water wasn’t enough for the people and the land. Hundreds of thousands of square miles became infertile. In the Beishi chronicles, the official history of the Northern Dynasties, mentions that in 536, in the province of Xi’an, 80% of the population died and the survivors ate corpses to survive.

The catastrophic event struck Korea, the Americas, Europe, Africa, and Australia.  While written records do not exist for all countries, archaeological and geological data revealed evidence of the climatic changes. Studies done on the trunks of trees, for example, showed that 536 AD had been the coldest in 1,500 years.

The important question in all of this is, why did it happen?  While there are no definite answers, one theory that has been put forward is that there was a large asteroid or comet impact which landed in the sea (if it hit land there would be evidence of a crater). Geologist Dallas Abbott is one proponent of this view and bases his view on evidence that he found studying ice cores from Greenland. However, this wouldn’t explain the dim light of the sun, and no tsunamis have been recorded for this period, which would have occurred if an asteroid landed in the ocean.

Another theory that has been put forward is a gigantic volcanic eruption – the dust thrown up into the atmosphere could have caused the dimming of the light.  One candidate is Krakatoa, located between the islands of Java and Sumatra in Indonesia. Indeed, the Book of the Ancient Kings or Pustaka Raja Purwa, written in 1869, describes an ancient volcano.

There was a furious shaking of the earth, total darkness, thunder and lighting.
… Then came forth a furious gale together with torrential rain and a deadly storm darkened the entire world.
… When the waters subsided it could be seen that the island of Java had been split into two, this creating the island of Sumatra.

However, this manuscript refers to the year 416 AD and not 535 AD.  Nevertheless, the fact that it was written in the 19th century could account for inaccuracies in the time reference.

Whether or not the answer will ever be found is unknown. It is unclear whether scientists are even continuing to pursue research on this event. One thing that is quite peculiar about this global cataclysm is that it is a very little known event. Why is it that this climatic event is not taught in schools? Why isn’t there a plethora of research examining it? Perhaps it is because it reminds us of our fragility as human beings and the fact that no matter how powerful and ‘advanced’ mankind becomes, we are still at the mercy of nature.

By John Black


AD 536: The year that winter never ended

Global Cataclysm in 535 AD

Catastrophe: An investigation into the Origins of the Modern World, David Keys, Century, London

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Offline zorgon

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #17 on: June 05, 2015, 06:44:39 PM »
Suppressed by the Pope? Why? Was England (no UK back then) Christian at the time?

Well you have to say something like "Suppressed bt the PTB of the day" if you want a conspiracy :P

If we don't know that the event happened in FACT then either it never happened or the knowledge was suppressed by someone... and if the latter, the Vatican secret vaults are the most likely

Just saying :P

space otter

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2015, 07:09:11 PM »
for the church  quote from below

Did you know that the founding of Christianity happened in Britain 35-37 AD, well before Rome knew about it? Of course you didn’t, I didn’t know before I discovered the work of Wilson and Blackett too.

lots to read here..very interesting and in depth site..plan on reading awhile
The Historical Vortigern
This period, which is often called the Dark Ages, stretched roughly from AD 400 to 600. Vortigern Studies is mainly concerned with the events that brought about the changes from Roman Britain to Saxon England. Articles about his family and sources attempt to unravel the complex process that saw the ending of Roman influence in the lands across the Channel, and which ended with the occupation of Britain by the Anglo-Saxons.


Ancient Britain the Island of the Dead - Part 2
Hidden and Secret Archaeology

Ancient Britain Index


There are things about British history that many of you do not realise. We have mentioned already about the Romans being invited to Britain to aid in tribal wars, rather than them invading us. We have also mentioned that there is no evidence whatsoever about a Celtic invasion of Britain. In fact it was made up by the Anglo - Saxons to remove our true heritage and leave us more open to their history. We also know that many University Professors also believe that their was no Celtic invasion or mass settlement.

In 1714 King George I became king of Britain, this was around the time that British history was to become a thing of the past, and the new false history would begin due to the court historians making it more acceptable to the House of Hanover. It was though only when Queen Victoria married Prince Albert Saxe-Coberg-Gotha that this suppression of the true history of Britain really took hold, through the newly appointed Regius Professor of Modern History at Oxford University Bishop William Stubbs (1866). It was Bishop Stubbs who set about completely reforming the subject and suppressing all the texts from before this time. He based his new approach to our history around the newly emerging science of archaeology. With this approach he revised all British history within all our schools and universities, which todays archaeologists and historians still swear by.

The Anglo - Saxon invasion is another made up piece of history. The true story is that when they came to this land to settle they found it primarily empty due to the comet of 562AD that devastated Britain and left it inhabitable for about a decade. The true British having left for Britanny and other parts of Europe till they could return. When they did return they found these Anglo - Saxons here and began to push them back out. These are the tribal wars that you hear about but are not told the entire truth surrounding them.

Yes we mention a comet in the year 562AD, that most of you will not have heard of, or read about or even been told by any teacher at school, but it did happen. If you ask they will tell you it never happened. Well, this comet is actually mentioned by various people writing about our history such as Gildas, Sir Thomas Mallory and Tysiios. All these writings are dismissed and ignored by archaeologists and historians. If these people were not telling the truth then why would there be a stone in St. Pauls, London that was found in 1850 telling the story of the comet, because it does not fit in with current thinking.

Just like the above these same historians and archaeologists tell you that the ancient British did not leave written records, but they did. These ancient texts still remain mainly in other countries and in Wales but these again are dismissed as fairy stories. This was mainly due to historians and archaeologists of the past saying that well, Troy does not exist, so these histories of Britain that also mention Troy are not real. Since then though most people now know that Troy was actually discovered in 1876, so is fact and not fiction. So why is British history still being ignored.

It is like they believe that most of these ancient writers about our land are idiots that got it wrong. Yes they may have altered the writings for political and religious viewpoints of the time, but the fact still remains that they still show Britain in a good light. So these people like Gildas, Sir Thomas Mallory, Julius Caesar, Homer and Marcellinus just to name a few all got it wrong, I don't think so.
For instance Marcellinus states that the Greeks got their alphabet from the British. We also have Julius Caesar saying that the British alphabet was similar to the Greeks.

Another myth surrounding the ancient British is that of the Roman invasion of Britain and what they did for us. Now Tacitus tells us that "In Britain after the captivity of Caradoc. the Romans were repeatedly defeated and put to the rout by the single state of the Silures alone". The Silures by the way were a tribal kingdom from the South West of Britain. We also know that the Britons used chariots for war as Diodorus Siculus (60BC) states: "The Britons live in the same manner that the ancients did: they fight in chariots, as the ancient heroes of Greece are said to have done in the Trojan wars". These chariots are what were used by the Britons when they sent the Romans packing in 55 and 54BC. This to me does not sound like a land of Barbarians who were invaded and run by Romans. This sounds more like a civilized society who could keep anyone from their land. We do also know that in times of invasion all the states of Britain would join together under the leadership of the Pendragon. So if the Romans could not defeat a single state here, then how could they have invaded and controlled us. It just does not make any sense. Its like historians telling you that the Romans built our roads, when you can see from what ancient writers wrote on the country that we used chariots. Surely we would have roads for these.

Now if you read most books on ancient Briton you will notice one strange thing about them, they all start generally with the Celts and the Romans. This seems strange that they do not dwell much on before this time, when most of our countryside is of monuments to the peoples that date from about 1000BC and before. Is this because we were too civilized for world history.

In a book which is a reprint of an article from the "Archaeologia Cambrensis", New Series, 1854 titled "An Account of Two Druidical Circles and a Roman Camp on a mountain near Trecastle in Brecknockshire by William Rees" there is a footnote by Edd. Arch. Camb. that gives two fascinating and interesting ideas and facts surrounding stone circles. Even though it states that these are Druidical Circles which is obviously incorrect, but was probably a thing of the time, it mentions what peasants actual thought stone circles were used for and also contains information about Phoenician monuments that resembled Stonehenge in every detail. This just shows, how modern history keeps old information quiet. As these are two details that even some of the most knowledgable people on stone circles will not of heard of or about.

The following is the footnote in its entirety:
"1 The popular belief of the peasantry respecting these circles is, that they were formed for the purpose of the celebration of Games by the early Britons, at some remote period. The same opinion was expressed by a peasant to some of the members of this Association, who made an excursion to the Druidical circle at Nant-y-nôd, near Aberystwyth. Such a belief, if traditional, might possibly have arisen from the heathen practice alluded to in Exodus xxxii. 6-19, when after sacrificing, offering and feasting, the people "rose up to play." There appears also to be a similarity, if not identity, between the Phoenician worship of Baal in their sacred groves and circles, and the worship established in this country by the Druids; Lord Lindsay reports in his Travels in Egypt and the Holy Land, that there are at Soaf, Phoenician monuments identical in every respect with Stonehenge. - [It is to be observed, however, that permanent circular enclosures bearing the title of Plân an guare (the "playing-plain") are extremely common in Cornwall. They are surrounded by raised seats of turf, and in one instance (the Plân an guare of St. Just) of stone. The Cornish miracle-plays, of which specimens are still extant, were performed in them. -(Borlase's Cornwall, pp. 207, 208.) Do the coincident traditions mentioned by Mr. Rees, point to a similar practice in Wales? Or may they not show that primeval circles were used in later times for these purposes? On the other hand, as we know that games were connected in heathen countries with both religion and sepulture, Mr. Rees' supposition is quite compatible with either a ritual or a monumental use of the objects in question.-EDD. ARCH. CAMB.]"

Written and researched by Robert Worrall (ORRAR President)



you guys will probably like this angle

March 12, 2014March 12, 2014 Matt Taylor for Brighton Kemptown 2015 Alternative News, Ancient British History, Entertainment, King Arthur II, Royalty1066, 503 ad, alan wilson, arthurian, baram blackett, king arthur, richard d hall

Did you know that the founding of Christianity happened in Britain 35-37 AD, well before Rome knew about it? Of course you didn’t, I didn’t know before I discovered the work of Wilson and Blackett too.

The arrival of Christianity in Rome with the family of the British King Caradoc I in 51 AD is admitted by the Vatican, but not very loudly or too frequently. FACT- CHECK IT OUT.

ImageArthur’s Cross
The destruction of Arthurian Britain in 562 AD, after comet debris passed overhead, was born into folklore and historical record. Centuries later the romance writer on the sagas of King Arthur related the strange great blast, which wrecked the Great Castle and devastated the Arthurian Kingdom. They wrote of the Great Wastelands that held death for all who dared to enter, and amazingly none of this was believed to be factual and true.

The Dark Ages.

By denying the destruction of Britain by debris, comet or asteroids, from outer space in 562 AD, it was easily possible to pour scorn on the records that a great powerful and highly civilized British state had ever existed.

Read more: Simmering in poop since 1066.

In place of the comet disaster, which overwhelmed the powerful 10 million strong British in 562 AD, there was to be a newly minted Anglo-Saxon Conquest.

ImageBlackett, Wilson & Hall
Just how three boat-loads of Saxons, hired as coastguards by the usurper Gwrtheyrn (Vortigern) in the civil war raging in 426 AD, could defeat the military aggressive British who had evaded Gaul and seized all Western Europe under Magnus Maximus and his eldest son Arthur I in 383 AD with an army of 62,000, and repeated the act under a cousin Constantine Coronog- the Crowned, in 406 AD, is not explained.

Instead a new minimal population in ancient Britain was adopted. This nation instead of constantly defeating the Romans was now said to have been weak and cowardly and defeated by the Romans.

ImageHistory stood on its head.

History can never hide the fact that an ancient British Civilization were in Britain for a thousand years before the Angles and Saxons.

The first British King was King Brutus and it gets even better.

Prince Madoc, King Arthur II’s brother, discovered America in 562 AD, the same year the asteroid hit. Evidently he was out at sea when disaster struck and got blown all the way to America.  Of-course the entire event had to be obliterated, and the tale of a fleet of 700 ships sailing to America was declared a fiction, just as Troy was declared a fiction, as was King Arthur and those feet in ancient times that walked upon the green green grass of home, was declared but a lyric in a song.

Back to The King Arthur Conspiracy for this damning verdict.

Nothing can be assumed.

The first assumption is that the Romans conquered all Britain, wrong.
It is assumed that the Romans totally dominated Britain for either 450 or 400 years, incorrect.
It is assumed that early Christianity spread from Rome out Westwards across Europe to Britain, bunkum.
It is assumed that there was then a subsequent Anglo-Saxon conquest of Britain, wrong.
It is summed that the ancient British were barbarian “Celts”, nonsense.
It is assumed that the ancient British were of a low culture and illiterate, untrue.
It is assumed that they were few in number and they were primitive, wrong.
In short, all the most basic and fundamental points upon which any standard approach is made towards ancient British historical study is based upon are provably false assumptions.

There are two histories in Britain:

One is the phony version dreamed up and invented in the 19th Century.
The other is the real history of Britain, shrouded in a myopic fog of mis-directions, unfounded assumptions and indolence.
Join me again as we explore further the real life figure of King Arthur II and his Arthurian Kingdom.

enough for this night  ;D
« Last Edit: June 05, 2015, 07:14:08 PM by space otter »

Offline Pimander

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #19 on: June 06, 2015, 02:05:03 AM »
I am sooooooo sorry ....for those of you who may find the facts (if you ever managed to read any of this) get in the way of your voices
I think you'll find I know a lot more about this topic than most and I have read far more than this about it.  Also in my opinion the writers of this material may have been wrong about some of this.  Regardless of what the writer of one of those pieces says, there really is a lot less historical material to refer to and almost none of it is written by the native "Brits".

Offline ArMaP

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #20 on: June 06, 2015, 04:26:51 AM »
well I have found that it is fascinating that folks have such strong opinions before doing any reading on a subject ..especially when references are provided
they just shout out stuff
I can only speak for myself, but when confronted with a long(ish) list of links, at the end of the last day of a tiring week, I am not really that interested in clicking blindly on a link that may be useful or useless, as no kind of reference to what each of those links pointed to was given.

Also, although I didn't read it, it doesn't mean I cannot have an opinion based on the little information provided. You want me to post a more informed opinion? Give me more information instead of just throwing a handful of links.

And what's the difference between our "shouting out stuff" and someone else's "shouting out stuff" about a hypothetical comet? Why are their "shouts" more important than mine? Because they wrote it on some site and make it look backed by facts (where those facts, just pointing names means nothing, if those people wrote something then they wrote it somewhere, so where are those documents where those people wrote things that back up that information)?

Seriously, of the little (I didn't read it all, walls of text are not appealing to me) I read it looks more like an attempt at creating a hypothetical "great British civilization" for which they give no real signs of having existed. It sounds too much of "racial supremacy" for my taste.  ::)

PS: sorry for having an opinion.  :P

Offline micjer

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #21 on: June 06, 2015, 05:36:54 AM »

This is very interesting.  Last couple of links are very helpful.  Also finished listening to interview. 
The only people in the world, it seems, who believe in conspiracy theory, are those of us that have studied it.    Pat Shannon

space otter

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #22 on: June 06, 2015, 07:21:30 AM »

gentlemen.. you are among my favorite posters.. but this morning I want to giggle and point at you two and go
nah nah nah nah nah..made you post.. ;D

what can I say.. sorry..i was in a pissy mood to start this thread and it just continued...sigh

I did come across something that also made me smile and kinda sorta defines history from anywhere.. that it was written way after  it happened (hundreds of years) and from an oral tradition that makes it suspect to start with.

here is another link to a wall of text but only copying some interesting tidbits..
the reason for this stuff was to pin down any info on the supposed comet of 562/4..and imo the only way to do that is to question the sources of the stories
so far not much of the stuff is reliable and it is  a case of believe it or don't..

The narrative is unclear because it was written from oral memory. The experience of our own age or any other defines the limits of oral memory. So it was with Gildas. In youth he knew older men who had lived through the wars, but few who were adult before they began. Though we need not have any hesitation in accepting e.g. his testimony of the five kings reigning in his day, I would not blindly accept what he has to say about their character. We should not mistake Gildas for a modern historian who is giving us an unbiased report of history, nor was he writing an objective chronicle of his times. Nevertheless, Gildas is our most important source for the history of Britain and the organization of the ‘Celtic church’ during the fifth and early sixth centuries

What we are sure about is which sources Gildas used. From his seemingly anachronistic prose style, Gildas shows that he was a man with a classical education, which must have been very rare at that date. Gildas was familiar which most of the books of the bible, both the older Vetus Latina version as well as the newer Vulgate version from Jerome. He used works by Vergil (Aeneid), Rufinus, Orosius, Sulpicius Severus, John Cassian and Prudentius. These authors, together with his perfect grammar and syntax (no vulgarisms), show the high quality of his classical education from what could hardly have been anything other than a British school. His scheme was Christian, however, and not classical. The text shows his enormous dependence on the bible and on biblical themes.

The Text
The earliest manuscript of De Excidio et Conquestu Britanniae (I will refer henceforth to DEB) dates only from the eleventh century, with the rest later. There are several other witnesses of DEB, which I have entered here below with the earliest manuscripts of DEB:

It has been argued for a long time that the DEB was not one single document, or even a forgery, mostly dating it to the seventh century. As early as the later middle ages authors such as John Bale (1557) had separated the Historia from the Epistola, thinking that it must have been written by two different authors. James Ussher took this up, and declared (1639) that there were two authors, one datable to the fifth century and the second to the sixth (above). Especially the nineteenth century gave rise to a new revisionism that sprang up in the wake of ‘modern’ Christian theological debate. Authors interpreted Gildas’ anti-Roman (Catholic) criticism as anachronistic or even protestant (!)

so having trashed some early writings we are left with what the archaeologist think they are finding now and their suppositions about the vitrified stones and such..
something big obviously happened but if the folks had to scramble  to exist I don't think anyone was taking notes no social media back then. ;)

however doing the searches to try and get a handle on it is fascinating imo ;D

space otter

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #23 on: June 06, 2015, 05:31:20 PM »
 I had just found this bit about the Moche (listed first - below)
then thought to  look for extreme weather and here's  tons of info on
Extreme weather events of 535–536

with tons of  sources listed at the link..probably should have started there..
they establish that there was a world event but they are still lining up volcanoes as the cause
the real contradiction is the vitrified stones  so the search continues  ;D

and how totally interesting that at the bottom of the page this is there:

This page was last modified on 9 May 2015, at 10:40


Almost immediately Thompson and his team noticed something intriguing. The historic records showed that over the last one hundred years, every time the ice cores showed drought in the mountains, it corresponded to a particular kind of wet weather on the coast, a weather system known as an El Nino. In other words drought in the mountains meant an El Nino on the coast. If Thompson could trace back the climate record in the mountains he'd also get a picture of what happened on the coast.

The result was fascinating. The climate record suggested that at around 560 to 650 AD – the time the Moche were thought to have collapsed – there had been a 30-year drought in the mountains, followed by 30 years or so of heavy rain and snow.

If the weather on the coast was the opposite, then it suggested a 30-year El Nino - what climatologists call a mega El Nino – starting at around 560 AD, which was followed by a mega drought lasting another 30 years. Such a huge series of climatic extremes would have been enough to kill off an civilization – even a modern one. Here, at last, was a plausible theory for the disappearance of the Moche. But could it be proved?


The extreme weather events of 535–536 were the most severe and protracted short-term episodes of cooling in the Northern Hemisphere in the last 2,000 years.[1] The event is thought to have been caused by an extensive atmospheric dust veil, possibly resulting from a large volcanic eruption in the tropics,[2] and/or debris from space impacting the Earth.[3] Its effects were widespread, causing unseasonal weather, crop failures, and famines worldwide.[3]

Documentary evidence[edit]
The Byzantine historian Procopius recorded of 536, in his report on the wars with the Vandals, "during this year a most dread portent took place. For the sun gave forth its light without brightness... and it seemed exceedingly like the sun in eclipse, for the beams it shed were not clear."[4][5]

The Gaelic Irish Annals[6][7][8] record the following:

"A failure of bread in the year 536 AD" – the Annals of Ulster
"A failure of bread from the years 536–539 AD" – the Annals of Inisfallen
Further phenomena reported by a number of independent contemporary sources:

Low temperatures, even snow during the summer (snow reportedly fell in August in China, which caused the harvest there to be delayed)[9]
Crop failures[10]
"A dense, dry fog" in the Middle East, China and Europe[9]
Drought in Peru, which affected the Moche culture[9][11]

Scientific evidence[edit]
Tree ring analysis by dendrochronologist Mike Baillie, of the Queen's University of Belfast, shows abnormally little growth in Irish oak in 536 and another sharp drop in 542, after a partial recovery.[12] Similar patterns are recorded in tree rings from Sweden and Finland, in California's Sierra Nevada and in rings from Chilean Fitzroya trees.[citation needed] Ice cores from Greenland and Antarctica show evidence of substantial sulfate deposits around 533–534 ± 2 years, evidence of an extensive acidic dust veil.[2]

Possible explanations[edit]
It has been conjectured that these changes were due to ashes or dust thrown into the air after the eruption of a volcano (a phenomenon known as "volcanic winter"),[13] or after the impact of a comet[14] or meteorite.[15][16] The evidence of sulfate deposits in ice cores strongly supports the volcano hypothesis; the sulfate spike is even more intense than that which accompanied the lesser episode of climatic aberration in 1816, popularly known as the "Year Without a Summer", which has been connected to the explosion of the volcano Mount Tambora in Sumbawa, Indonesia.[2]

In 1984, R. B. Stothers postulated that this event might have been caused by the volcano Rabaul in what is now New Britain island near Papua New Guinea.[17]

In 1999, David Keys in his book Catastrophe: A Quest for the Origins of the Modern World (supported by work of the American volcanologist Ken Wohletz), suggested that the Indonesian volcano Krakatoa exploded at the time and caused the changes.[13] It is suggested that an eruption of Krakatoa attributed to the year 416 by the Javanese Book of Kings actually took place at this time, 535–536, there being no other evidence of such an eruption in 416.[18]

In 2009, Dallas Abbott of Columbia University's Lamont–Doherty Earth Observatory in New York published evidence from Greenland ice cores that multiple comet impacts caused the haze. The spherules found in the ice may originate from terrestrial debris ejected into the atmosphere by an impact event.[1][19]

In 2010, Robert Dull, John Southon and colleagues presented evidence suggesting a link between the Tierra Blanca Joven (TBJ) eruption of the Ilopango caldera in central El Salvador and the AD 536 event.[20] Although earlier published radiocarbon evidence suggested a two-sigma age range of AD 408–536,[21] which is consistent with the global climate downturn, the connection between AD 536 and Ilopango was not explicitly made until research on Central American Pacific margin marine sediment cores by Steffen Kutterolf and colleagues showed that the phreatoplinian TBJ eruption was much larger than previously thought.[22] The radioactive carbon-14 in successive growth increments of a single tree that had been killed by a TBJ pyroclastic flow was measured in detail using Accelerator mass spectrometry; the results supported the date of AD 535 as the year in which the tree died. A conservative bulk tephra volume for the TBJ event of ~84 km3 was calculated, indicating a large Volcanic Explosivity Index 6+ event and a magnitude of 6.9. The results suggest that the Ilopango TBJ eruption size, latitude and age are consistent with the ice core sulphate records of Larsen et al. 2008.

Historic consequences[edit]
The 536 event and ensuing famine have been suggested as an explanation for the deposition of hoards of gold by Scandinavian elites at the end of the Migration Period. The gold may have been deposited as a sacrifice to appease the gods and get the sunlight back.[23][24]

The decline of Teotihuacán, a huge city in Mesoamerica, is also correlated with the droughts related to the climate changes, with signs of civil unrest and famines.

David Keys' book speculates that the climate changes may have contributed to various developments, such as the emergence of the Plague of Justinian, the decline of the Avars, the migration of Mongolian tribes towards the West, the end of the Sassanid Empire, the collapse of the Gupta Empire, the rise of Islam, the expansion of Turkic tribes, and the fall of Teotihuacán.[11] In 2000, a 3BM Television production (for WNET and Channel Four) capitalized upon Keys' book. This documentary, under the name Catastrophe! How the World Changed, was broadcast in the US as part of PBS's Secrets of the Dead series. However, Keys and Wohletz' ideas are not widely accepted at this point. Reviewing Keys' book, the British archaeologist Ken Dark commented that "much of the apparent evidence presented in the book is highly debatable, based on poor sources or simply incorrect" and that "Nonetheless, both the global scope and the emphasis on the 6th century AD as a time of wide-ranging change are commendable, and the book contains some fascinating and obscure information which will be new to many. However, it fails to demonstrate its central thesis and does not offer a convincing explanation for the many changes discussed."[25]

External links[edit]
"536 and all that", from Real Climate, March 2008.

CCNet Debate: The Ad 536-540 Mystery: Global Catastrophe, Regional Event or Modern Myth
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This page was last modified on 9 May 2015, at 10:40

edit to remove bold was too hard to read
« Last Edit: June 06, 2015, 05:58:25 PM by space otter »

space otter

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #24 on: June 06, 2015, 05:42:23 PM »

536 AD and all that

Filed under: Aerosols
 Climate Science
 — gavin @ 2 March 2008 - (Deutsch) (Español)

“during this year a most dread portent took place. For the sun gave forth its light without brightness… and it seemed exceedingly like the sun in eclipse, for the beams it shed were not clear.”

This quote from Procopius of Caesarea is matched by other sources from around the world pointing to something – often described as a ‘dry fog’ – and accompanied by a cold summer, crop failures and a host of other problems. There’s been a TV special, books and much newsprint speculating on its cause – volcanoes, comets and other catastrophes have been suggested. But this week there comes a new paper in GRL (Larsen et al, 2008) which may provide a definitive answer….

 It’s long been known that tree-rings (such as the one pictured from Arizona) often show an extremely small growth ring for AD 536 (you can count back from the marked AD 550 ring). In fact, if you look at the mean anomaly in a whole range of tree ring constructions, this event stands out along with 1601 and 1815 (known volcanic events) as being exceptional over the last 2000 years.

Average of the high-frequency components of 7 northern European tree ring reconstructions from Larsen et al, 2008. The filtering ensures that uncertainties in long term trends (which are not important in this context) don’t confuse the issue. These data match the written sources quite well. However, tying it to a cause has always been plagued with problems of chronology. An initial attempt to tie this event to a volcanic pulse in the Dye3 ice core in Greenland foundered when the chronology was revised to put it 20 years earlier. However, there has recently been a concerted effort to place all the Greenland ice cores on a common timescale based on annual layer counts (Vintner et al, 2006). Because all the cores are being counted together, ambiguities in one can be corrected by reference to the others. Once the dates have been better established, the sulphate records (which generally show the impact of volcanic aerosols) can be examined to see if they line up. And low and behold, they do:

The second peak in the picture is dated at 534 AD which is close enough to 536 AD given the one or two year uncertainty in counting. Note that the 534 AD peak is actually smaller than the one a few years earlier. In assessing the importance of an eruption though, it isn’t enough to have just a peak in Greenland. That could simply signify an eruption that was close by. Instead, people look for a matching peak in Antarctica. This signifies that the eruption was likely tropical and the aerosols were carried into both hemispheres by the stratospheric circulation. Here is where previous attempts often faltered. The dating of ice cores in Antarctica is less exact than in Greenland because the accumulation is slower (it doesn’t snow as much). However, the relatively new Dronning Maud Land (DML) core has comparable resolution to the Greenland ones, and this one does have a clear sulphate peak at about 542 +/- 17 years. That is good enough to be a match to the 536 AD peak in Greenland. The correction you’d need to make to align them exactly would also fix some other apparent offsets for smaller events in the subsequent 100 years. So it probably was a volcano, somewhere in the tropics, and it was likely the size of Tambora in 1815. There has been some speculation that it was an earlier eruption of Krakatoa (which went off again in 1883), but that is uncertain, as are the numerous consequences such as the fall of the Rome or the rise of Islam which have been attributed to this event. While not exploring that too deeply, this quote from Michael the Syrian indicates dramatically the potential for climate events like this one to really spoil your day: “The sun was dark and its darkness lasted for eighteen months; each day it shone for about four hours; and still this light was only a feeble shadow … the fruits did not ripen and the wine tasted like sour grapes.”

160 Responses to “536 AD and all that”

Offline Pimander

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #25 on: June 08, 2015, 08:59:22 AM »
Looking at the tree rings there, there was a bad year in 543 in Arizona.  That ring looks about as thin as 536.

Offline DillTheDog

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2017, 02:19:34 PM »
Hi Guys, so can anyone give any update on the comet ! did some of it break apart on entry and parts hit somewhere around the UK ? and or has anyone established where it did hit, or was it all air burst fragments. 

Offline astr0144

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Re: 562 comet in erased history
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2017, 03:55:32 PM »
Interesting topic for your 1st Post Dill...and Welcome !

but I had glad you referred to it as I have not seen it before.

I do not know the answer to your question as yet, If I come up with a suggestion, I would hope to post it..but it may be difficult to give an answer.

Also thanks to Sky for creating the thread..

I have been looking for some information from the Dark ages..from the end of the Romans to 1066...about good and bad times..and this may be very useful..and as Sky / the posts has indicated it seems it was covered up.

I know populations may have been less back then, than some hundereds of years later , but I wonder how that disaster compared to say the Black death..or the 1300s that I thought may had been the worst period in the uk in the last 2000 yrs..

Hi Guys, so can anyone give any update on the comet ! did some of it break apart on entry and parts hit somewhere around the UK ? and or has anyone established where it did hit, or was it all air burst fragments.
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