Perhaps we should start at the top, in worlds other than ours, and then
work our way back, very much, down to the depths. You can always be
sure that wherever two or three are gathered together to listen to
channeling, Ashtar will be there too. Here is a message channeled by
'Lady Nada' in 1996, under the title 'Home Questions From Our
Visitors'. The presentation and spelling are verbatim!
Ques: What is the Relation of the Ashtar Command & the Human Race?
Ans: The Ashtar Command are among many entities that come to Earth and
have been circle above the Earth-for the most part invisible to the
naked Eye Since early 1950's A.D. . . There have been many people who
were contacted by Extra-Terra-Astrals. Some of their stories were
fabricated and some were authentic. These Beings from Aldebaran were
insulted after they were labeled untrustworthy. They Went back in time
and had a meeting of psychics with the Thule Society who were a secret
society. The meeting of the Thule Society led to what is Called the
Third Rite (Reich). The Ashtar Command were also in contact with two
psychics, named Maria Austish and Zigrum who were in contact with
Hitler. Hitler and Nazi Germany were building crafts during WWII.
Hitler assembled a team of elite and intelligent scientist and
engineers who were experts in the field of Aerodynamics. They began
designs for the flying disc in 1941 A.D. During the year 1945-47 three
German experts Schriver, Habermohl, and Meithe and an Italian A.
Bellonzo were involved in R&D of a saucer-shaped craft. On February
14,1945 A.D. Shriver & Habermohl flew a disc that within 3 minutes
climb to an altitude of 12,400 meters and reached a speed of 2,000 km/h
in horizontal flight. This technology was given to them by the Ashtar
Billy Meier and P'taah
Billy Meier, the Swiss contact and photographer of beings, and craft,
from the Pleiades, has never really convinced me of the objective
reality of either his contacts or his photos. I am certainly not alone
in taking that view, and my opinion has not been improved by a
conversation that Meier reports in Volume 1, No 6 of his FIGU Bulletin,
published in English in October 1997. A reader - "Til Meisterhans,
Germany" - quotes from a balanced, and quite sceptical, article
"article in the January 1980 edition of UFO magazine", and asks
"What should one think of the claim that during World War II the
Germans built flying disks, respectively flying "Foo Fighters," and
actually flew them?
Those of you who are accustomed to the staking of claims for
responsibility for anomalous objects and events will not be surprised
to find that Meier cannot resist responding with "information" to which
only he has access. He writes
"The following is worth mentioning: According to the
Pleiadians/Plejarans, such "Foo Fighters" or disks were constructed in
Germany but were never test flown, let alone put into service. Anyone
claiming such flying devices reached speeds of several thousand
kilometers per hour, flew at altitudes of 12.000 meters [36,000 ft.],
and actually reached Mars, is talking complete nonsense. The authentic
story about these events is discussed in the 254th contact conversation
with P'taah on November 28, 1995:
"Billy: . . .You know, my dear friend, now and then one hears strange
things regarding the German flying disks. Is it true that the Germans
actually attempted to fly them, and did the disks reach altitudes of up
to 12,000 meters?
Ptaah: Such claims are absurd. The "Flying Tops," as they were called,
were never finalized in Germany. However, flying disks were eventually
built some time later in other countries, e.g., in South America. In
the former Soviet Union and in America attempts were also made to
construct such flying devices after pertinent blueprints fell into the
hands of Germany’s occupying forces. These blueprints were incomplete
in that those who held the plans needed to input a great deal of effort
to construct the flying disks. These units were and are flown in
terrestrial air space only to this day, excluding, of course, a
particular group of people in South America of which you are well
Billy: Can you also tell me whether the blueprints for this type of
flying disks secured by the occupying forces were the same ones you
people telepathically transmitted to the Germans via impulses? Who was
actually in charge in Germany?
The transmissions were directed to two men, Schriever and Miethe who,
on their own, had drawn up plans for the "Flying Tops." These
blueprints fell into the hands of the Americans and Soviets who began
studying and constructing the units. Also, through theft, the group in
South America obtained copies of the same "Flying Tops."
One can say with certainty that this group consisted of high-ranking
Nazis who fled from Germany after the war ended and disappeared in
Ptaah: You should not mention any more about this subject.
Billy: Of course not. --- On account of World War II, disk-shaped
flying objects were observed also in Germany, indeed, worldwide . . .
Ptaah: You are correct in this, yes. However, these flying objects were
not of terrestrial origin. They belonged to us and to our allies from
Billy: This would mean that the flying disks which had been observed
were not related to the flying disks, respectively "Flying Tops" disks,
or Foo Fighters, of the Germans. Claims to the contrary, therefore, are
actually foolish assertions by liars, fantasists, and know-it-alls.
We've wanted to know about this for a long time.
Ptaah: What I have told you only refers to the Schriever and Miethe Foo Fighters.
Billy: You mean there were others?
Ptaah: Yes, others did exist. However, they were part of a private
research program conducted by power hungry Nazis who drew upon
Schriever's and Miethe's blueprints. Efforts to develop and test fly
their Foo Fighters were underway with positive results in Germany at
Billy: By the group now in South America?
Ptaah: Your conjecture is correct.
Billy: And all of this took place right under the nose of the Gestapo?
Ptaah: Many influential members of the Gestapo and its SS-leadership
were secret, active participants who attempted to prevent the rest of
the world from gleaning any information about the construction, test
flights, and other matters. When the war ended, they fled Germany and
went to South America, taking with them all of their material and
staff. This was not a difficult task, for the Foo Fighters had reached
a point were they had the capability of circling the Earth non-stop and
transporting all required personnel and materials to South America
before the Allied Forces could seize them --- or prior to the Allied
Forces finding out anything about these secrets.
Billy: So that's how this all happened. How far did the construction of Schriever's and Miethe's Foo Fighters progress?
Ptaah: The prototype for the first test flight was available on July
15, 1941. We monitored this very closely. The Foo Fighter was, however,
not constructed according to the data we had transmitted, for we had
intentionally made them ineffective by then, as we could foresee the
grave danger they would present for terrestrial mankind. [Comments by
Billy: The Pleiadians/Plejarans transmitted data for the construction
of flying disks to the Germans Schriever and Miethe at the end of the
1920s and beginning of 1930s with the intent to produce an aeronautical
technology that would help prevent the looming warfare conflicts.
Unfortunately, they soon realized that this technology would be used
for the exact opposite purposes. For this reason, the
Pleiadians/Plejarans counteracted the undertaking again.] We did not
attempt to interfere in the development of Schriever's and Miethe's Foo
Fighter until we suddenly recognized that the units also posed an
immense threat to mankind. Once we realized the flight was going to be
a full success, and that mass production of the Foo Fighter would
result, we intervened during the preparations to the first test flight."
This 'dialogue' continues on for some time, until Meier concludes
" . . fantastic stories were concocted about flying disks/Foo Fighters
which were said to have reached altitudes of 12,000 meters [7_ miles]
and Mach 2 or more during their first test flight (which never did take
place). Additionally, a fairy tale tells of the Germans having flown to
Mars, landing and performing studies there, so that they could inhabit
the planet one day. Complete nonsense, all of it. Billy" 
Henry Stephens runs the 'German Research Project', and sells copies
both of much of the pro-mythos material, and of more identifiably Nazi
and arguably ant--Semitic material. In an article in 'The Probe',
referring to the work supposedly done on a flying disc by A.V. Roe in
Canada, he claims that one of the recorded contributors to the project
is shown as "Miethe-Designer 1950(?)" Spinning off into the realms of
imagination, Stephens continues
"The reference is obviously about Dr Heinrich (Heinrich? How many names
does this man have?) Richard Miethe, who was the designer and builder
of the wartime German saucer project, the V-7. Dr Miethe worked during
the war at a German facility in Breslau, now part of modern Poland.
After the war, he was recruited by the Americans and Canadians to
recapitulate his earlier work for Germany in America. Renato Vesco, an
Italian engineer who worked with the Germans during the war and who
afterwards held a cabinet position with the Italian government, states
that Kahla was the location where a turbo-jet powered German saucer
lifted off in its maiden flight in February of 1945. Vesco later wrote
a book about his experiences, originally titled 'Intercept but Don't Shoot'" 
Actually, for all his wild speculation, Vesco never claimed that he was
writing from his own experience, but details like that simply don't
bother Stephens, as he spirals off into wild assertions about German
free energy, atom bombs, Vril, Haunebu, Tesla, Montauk, the New World
Order and the rest. And all this from the man whose mail-order business
makes him one of the more influential figures in this strange field.
His 1998 catalogue outlines the purposes of the GRP
German Research Project is an organization devoted to distributing
information concerning flying saucer-type devices made by the Germans
during the Second World War. Beyond this goal, we also hope to
distribute information concerning other German weaponry and technology,
such as free-energy technology, which is still kept secret and
classified by the former Allied Powers. We also hope to explore the
reasons for this secrecy. Part of this technology now comprises the
research being done by the Americans at Area 51. Much of this
technology was retained by a German organizations which did not
surrender at the cessation of hostilities. These groups and their
histories will be explored also.
The Germans built several types of flying craft which today we would
designate "UFOs". Some were conventionally powered, that is with jet
and rocket power, and some were powered electromagnetically. They were
built in different places throughout the greater German Reich by
different organizations within the government. They were kept under the
tightest secrecy. Near the close of the War some of these devices were
disassembled and transported by U-boat or simply flown to secure areas
Today, especially since the unification of Germany, more and more
information is surfacing concerning these developments in spite of the
efforts by our government and its media to discredit, divert and
confuse the issue. For those individuals new to this topic, we suggest
first reading item number 16 in our catalogue, "Introduction To Secret
German Flying Discs Of World War 2" and any title from our video
The incidence of disinformation with relation to Nazi achievements in
general, and flying discs in particular, is high. Here's some parts of
an article by "Len Kasten" from the New Age glossy Atlantis Rising.
As usual, he adopts Vesco as an authority, and introduces Viktor
Schauberger into the myth. It may be that he actually produces the most
detailed account of disc-propulsion, too!
important anti-gravity weapons research was carried on near Prague
primarily by Viktor Schauberger and Richard Miethe. In 1944 Miethe, in
cooperation with the Italians, developed the large helium powered V-7
and the small one-man Vril models which achieved a speed of 2,900 km/hr
in flight tests . . Captain Hans Kohler developed the Hanibu 2 with a
diameter of 25 metres which carried a complete flight crew and was
powered by a simple electrogravitation motor called the Kohler
Converter . .
Kasten describes the (totally fictional) Kugelblitz as an "explosive gas weapon", having
"a 50-50 mixture of butane and propane, which was ignited by the
exhaust of the bombers . . direct gyroscopic stabilisation,
television-controlled flight, vertical take-off and landing, jam-free
radio control combined with radar blinding, infrared search 'eyes',
electrostatic weapon firing, hyper-combustible gas combined with a
total reaction turbine, and last, but not least, anti-gravity flight
technology. This was the incredible Kugelblitz or 'lightning ball'. If
it had emerged even six months earlier, could the war have turned out
differently? We will never know, because by this time the Allied armies
were rapidly converging on Berlin. So the Kugelblitz puffed out a
formation of bombers, and flew off into history - or did it?" 
We'll return to the 'formation of bombers' when we come to Wendelle Stevens
Those of you familiar with the fields of both pseudo-science and
pseudo-history - and pseudo pretty much anything, really - will already
know of the boundless imagination of Hatcher-Childress. In his
publication 'Man-Made UFOs 1944 - 1994, 50 Years of Suppression',
by "Renato Vesco and David Hatcher-Childress", Hatcher-Childress
actually republishes the whole of Vesco's first book (without really
making clear that's what it is), adds some early UFO photos that might
look like the ones he appears to believe were built in Germany during
the war, and speculations of his own. His "Summary of the Claims and
Evidence" has some familiar elements . . .
various experimental prototypes, including the rocket powered Miethe
and Schriever discs, production began on the small ten meter diameter
interceptor-fighters of the Vril series. The larger Haunibu series
began with the 25 meter Haunibu 1 & 2. These craft had canons
mounted underneath and were designed as "tank Killers".
The 74 meter Haunibu-3, designed as an anti-shipping craft for use over
long distances, was actually built and tested. It had inflatable rubber
cushions on the underside for landing. The 300 meter Haunibu-4 was on
the design board for interplanetary travel. It was disc shaped and
could also carry several of the smaller Vril craft. Also reportedly in
the design stage was an immense 330 meter cigar-shaped battleship.
Towards the end of the war, the Germans had developed interplanetary
craft with no moving parts which were capable of going to the Moon or
even Mars." 
In 'The Thesis of This Book', he also asserts that
"Some German divisions removed themselves to South America and
Antarctica in the few months and weeks before the end of the war . .
the Americans, British and Russians began to build test discoid
aircraft in the late 40s and 5Os. Isolated German pockets in South
America have intense UFO activity. Antarctic bases are probably vacated
or captured by Americans and Russians. Today, a seven-story or more
underground base run jointly by America and Russia exists at the South
I have no idea whether Hatcher-Childress actually believes this
nonsense. I suppose he must, because otherwise he'd be knowingly
misleading his many readers. Unfortunately, this concoction of a book
has created something of a new generation of believers, including the
UK author Alan Baker. In spite of his publisher's confident assertion
of his "meticulous research" for his book 'Invisible Eagle', Baker
accepted Hatcher-Childress without question, and now a new readership
is stuck with Vesco developing flying discs at Lake Garda and
investigating UFOs for the Italian Air Ministry, the reality of the
Feuerball and Kugelblitz, and the top-secret Projekt Saucer. One man's
research is another man's trip to the bookshop.
Wendelle Stevens, veteran ufologist and Billy Meier supporter has, he
says, been privy to a unique range of experiences pertaining to Nazi
UFOs. As well as having been "sent to Alaska to supervise the
installation of special equipment onboard B-29 bombers" to look for
"mysterious flying objects known as 'fire balls' or 'foo fighters'", he
claims in 'Alien Encounters'
issue 25 that the Vril and Haunebu discs "were used just once against
the Allies, in which they devastated a vast 800 bomber raid over
Germany, shooting down an unprecedented 200 in just one night".  Bomber Command clearly missed this tragedy when compiling its records.
David Icke, who in 'The Biggest Secret' takes the Nazi UFO mythos as true along with hundreds of other nonsensical beliefs, reports Stevens as saying that
"the Foo Fighters were sometimes grey-green, and sometimes red-orange.
They approached his aircraft as close as five metres and then just
stayed there, he said. They could not be shaken off or shot down and
caused many squadrons to either turn back or land." 
Stevens also purports that while working at the Air Technical
Intelligence Center he saw a map of Germany which was marked with nine
Saturn-shaped symbols. He later found out from Vladimir Terziski that
these were where Nazi research centres were located,
"By the end of the war the Nazis had nine secret research facilities
where they built two types of disc: the smaller 'Vril' craft, and the
much bigger 'Haunebu' Both of these were powered by a 'gravity null
field'. In test flights the craft rose 60,000ft in just six and a half
minutes, which radically outstripped the performance of any allied
Vanguard Science/KeelyNet/Al Pinto
Internet search for 'Nazi UFOs' and similar subjects is likely to
produce links to material by "Al Pinto" or "Tal", apparently "Sponsored
by Vanguard Sciences, PO Box 1031, Mesquite, TX 75150, USA" which
depends heavily on the article written under Vesco's name in 'Argosy'.
 Additional material re Nikola Tesla and Viktor Schauberger is
added to quotes from Vesco and Lusar, particularly a claim that
Schauberger had developed the 'Schriever, Habermohl, Miethe and
Bellonzo Flying Disc' at Malthausen Concentration Camp, using prisoners
to do the work. I still don't really know quite who "Al Pinto" and
"Tal" are, or what the underlying intention of 'Vanguard Sciences' may
be. The coincidence of the name 'Vanguard' with a prominent neo-Nazi
organisation has been mentioned to me on several occasions.
I did receive, through a friend who had published some earlier findings
on Nazi UFOs, a message from a Jack Veach who said (inter alia) that
"Mr McClure makes some very positive statements debunking a great deal
of untruths about Nazi UFOs, however I would like to offer him a
website and an email whereby he might find more information about Mr
I am a member of Vanguard Science, not Vangard Science, as he has
listed. This is a civilian group of folk, here in the Dallas-Ft Worth
area that are open-minded about the verity of science and have taken it
upon ourselves to study Tesla, Keely, and a host of others we feel have
been given the short-end of the stick with respect to technology and
Mr Jerry Decker and Mr Chuck Henderson could much better avail you of
information about Mr Vesco and his work. I personally had an English
translation of one of his works I gave away about ten years ago
pursuant the German V-7.
My father and his C.O. both saw Foo Fighters over Europe during WWII,
so that much is real. Neither my dad nor Col. Lasly knew anything about
UFOs, nor had any interest in them. What they did say was that between
the Foo Fighters and the Me-262s they encountered, they felt they would
be killed before the war was over in Europe.
I hope that will clear some things up for Mr McClure with respect to
Vanguard Science and Mr Vesco and hopefully all of us can clear the
riddle of the Nazi UFOs from all the smoke and mirrors that
unfortunately come to the fore on something of this nature."
My friend sent an e-mail back to Mr Veach, expressing my interest in
receiving further information about Vesco, but no response was
forthcoming. The post-mortem involvement of both mainstream and fringe
scientists in the development of flying discs has raised a variety of
names including Marconi, Einstein, Tesla, Schauberger, Keely and
others. I am unaware of any real evidence that Schauberger worked at
Malthausen using slave labour. If that suggestion is no more than
wishful thinking, then I am left wondering why anybody should wish for
Mark Ian Birdsall
Birdsall has long been an influential figure in ufology. Currently Editor of the newsstand magazine Unopened Files - Access a Number of Well Kept Secrets and Features Editor of UFO Magazine, he has an established interest in wartime UFO events. In his 1998 book Alien Base', Tim Good says
"Interestingly, there is circumstantial evidence that at least one of
the V~7 project aircraft was prototyped. According to the researcher
and author Mark Ian Birdsall, several projects involving a
circular-wing aircraft were conceived during the war, the most
elaborate of which was constructed by Dr Richard Miethe at facilities
in Breslau (Wroclaw), Poland, and in Prague. A small prototype was
rumoured to have flown over the Baltic Sea in January 1943, and two
full-scale aircraft with a diameter of 135 feet were eventually built.
Also, reports Birdsall, another V-7 project was a 'spinning saucer',
based on helicopter principles, about 35 feet in diameter, designed by
Rudolf Schriever, a small prototype of which was allegedly first flown
in 1943." 
Good's reference for these comments is given as "Birdsall, Mark Ian, Flying Saucers of the Third Reich: The Legacy of Prague-Kbely (pending publication). That book has not, as I write, yet been published.
In, I think, 1988, Birdsall had published the unfortunately-titled booklet 'The Ultimate Solution'
which, in just 29 pages, presented three different pictures of Hitler.
It also includes copies of US intelligence documents reporting the
newspaper accounts of George Klein's claims of the test-flight on 14
February 1945, diagrams of assorted Miethe-Schreiver-Bellonzo discs,
and some probably avoidably uncritical material about 'secret'
Antarctic exploration and the escape of Nazis from Germany at the end
of the war.  In 1992, in Vol.7 No.4 of the US 'UFO Magazine', he
wrote an article titled 'Nazi Secret Weapon - Foo Fighters of WWII',
and included illustrations of a supposed 'Schriever-Habermohl' disc. 
The introduction to the article says that Birdsall "just completed a
hefty manuscript which enlarges considerably the scope of the available
source material". It would be interesting to see what material Birdsall
has found, and whether his views might be influenced by what is being
published in this piece.
Ernst Zundel/Mattern Friedrich
Ernst Zundel, also known as Mattern Friedrich (the name under which he authored UFOs - Nazi Secret Weapon? )
and Christof Friedrich (how he has signed the copy of that book which I
have) has had considerable involvement in the distribution of material
regarded as Holocaust revisionism. He has often been described as an
Zundel sustained the 'Nazi UFO' myth
through much of the 1970s, presenting a mixture of Lusar, Schauberger,
and the 'Hitler survived/Nazi Antarctica' material, illustrated with
vague photos of uncertain provenance, and the usual diagrams from the
European press. He seems to have been unaware of Vesco, but could well
have introduced the idea that Schauberger worked actively on disc
development with slave labour. While not doubting the underlying
sincerity of Zundel in promoting German wartime achievements, a report
of comments he allegedly made to Frank Miele may well reflect his
attitude to his readers. Miele quotes Zundel as saying
"I realised that North Americans were not interested in being educated.
they want to be entertained. The book was for fun. With a picture of
the Fuhrer on the cover and flying saucers coming out of Antarctica it
was a chance to get on radio and TV talk shows. For about 15 minutes of
an hour program I'd talk about that esoteric stuff. Then I would start
talking about all those Jewish scientists in concentration camps,
working on these secret weapons. And that was my chance to talk about
what I wanted to talk about." 
Whatever else may be true of Zundel, I think I can safely say that his
work has no factual contribution to make to the 'Nazi UFO' debate. But
that doesn't mean that he hasn't influenced its development, or that
others less canny than he, but with similar beliefs, have not involved
themselves in the subject because they believe what he said.